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-   -   Nuggets Play (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/90546-nuggets-play.html)

Toren Wed Apr 11, 2012 10:07pm

Nuggets Play
 
APG

Any chance we can see 6:41 in the 4th quarter, Denver vs. Minnesota.

There's a restricted arc play that I wanted to get people's insight on, granted this isn't used for High School yet, but wanted thoughts on timing of whistle and application of restricted arc.

APG Thu Apr 12, 2012 01:06am

<iframe width="640" height="360" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/dCz95L5hM0Q" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

JRutledge Thu Apr 12, 2012 02:12am

I could have lived with a no call here, but if there is going to be a call based on the RA as I understand it, it would be on the defense.

Peace

Toren Thu Apr 12, 2012 08:02am

Quote:

Originally Posted by JRutledge (Post 837010)
I could have lived with a no call here, but if there is going to be a call based on the RA as I understand it, it would be on the defense.

Peace

What did you think of the timing of the whistle?

tref Thu Apr 12, 2012 08:59am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toren (Post 837028)
What did you think of the timing of the whistle?

Fanboy :D

Toren Thu Apr 12, 2012 09:04am

Quote:

Originally Posted by tref (Post 837034)
Fanboy :D

Not at all, I didn't mind the call. I personally thought the contact was marginal, but well within my limited knowledge of the restricted arc rule. So I had no problem with the block. What struck me as weird, was just the timing of the whistle.

Anyone else think the whistle was just unusually late?

twocentsworth Thu Apr 12, 2012 11:22am

Talking NCAA-M here: a secondary defender CAN be in/over the restricted area and make contact with the offensive player....so long as the contact is not deemed to be illegal (a block, a charge, or otherwise...).

Using the NBAs' terminology, I view this contact as being "incidental contact" or "marginal contact". I do not view it as "contact that warrants a foul". I would not have blown the whistle.

I do not have a problem with the perceived "lateness" of the whistle...The best officials will see the "start, development, and finish" of a play. That is what the Lead did here.....

Camron Rust Thu Apr 12, 2012 11:50am

Quote:

Originally Posted by twocentsworth (Post 837053)
Talking NCAA-M here: a secondary defender CAN be in/over the restricted area and make contact with the offensive player....so long as the contact is not deemed to be illegal (a block, a charge, or otherwise...).

Agree.

tref Thu Apr 12, 2012 12:08pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by twocentsworth (Post 837053)
Using the NBAs' terminology, I view this contact as being "incidental contact" or "marginal contact". I do not view it as "contact that warrants a foul". I would not have blown the whistle.

Take a look at the right leg of the defender that moves the airborne shooter slightly off of his path. Subtle but effective tactic IMO... enough to warrant a whistle on the miss, but not nearly enough to award an AND1.

Quote:

Originally Posted by twocentsworth (Post 837053)
I do not have a problem with the perceived "lateness" of the whistle...The best officials will see the "start, development, and finish" of a play. That is what the Lead did here.....

I thought the L did a great job of being patient! It seems as though he called the "walk under" as you see the defender takes two steps to his right after the shooter alighted & intiates lower body contact while standing in the arc.
I guarentee you had the shot went in it would've been a play-on.

Late & right trumps quick & wrong.

berserkBBK Thu Apr 12, 2012 12:35pm

I have a no call here.
I've worked with partners that have whistles on plays like this (After a missed shot). I've asked about it and there response is they don't like giving "ticky tack and ones" or "sloppy and ones."

bainsey Thu Apr 12, 2012 12:48pm

Would 4-White meet the definition of a secondary defender? I don't see any other defender in question.

I don't have a problem with the patient whistle, but I'm not convinced there was a foul here, so I'd have nothing.

JRutledge Thu Apr 12, 2012 12:52pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toren (Post 837028)
What did you think of the timing of the whistle?

I honestly do not know what that has to do with this play? It seemed fine to me what the official's timing was, I just think it was marginal contact looking at the replay, but I do see why something was called in real time. But I would hope I would not make that call considering no one seemed to be displaced and the defense simply stood there for the most part and prevented an easy shot. The only thing I would possibly question is if he made the call because of the arm contact but it appears he called a block instead.

Peace

tref Thu Apr 12, 2012 12:55pm

Hmmm I guess the calling official & myself are the only ones that saw the defender take 2 steps to his right & walk under the airborne shooter while in the arc :confused:

berserkBBK Thu Apr 12, 2012 01:02pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by tref (Post 837073)
Hmmm I guess the calling official & myself are the only ones that saw the defender take 2 steps to his right & walk under the airborne shooter while in the arc :confused:

I see the defender giving ground after contact. Nothing illegal.

JRutledge Thu Apr 12, 2012 01:02pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by tref (Post 837073)
Hmmm I guess the calling official & myself are the only ones that saw the defender take 2 steps to his right & walk under the airborne shooter while in the arc :confused:

I guess, because not only was he standing in that spot before the shooter went airborne (and I believe NBA rules are a little different here) the defender was standing in that spot. According to NCAA Rules and NF Rules that looks like he is in a LGP to me. It is very close too, but if it is that close I am giving the benefit to the defender, then again that is me.

Peace


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