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-   -   Well, It Finally Happened ... (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/87335-well-finally-happened.html)

Adam Thu Feb 02, 2012 02:42pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by PG_Ref (Post 819419)
As others have already stated, it can be corrected until the throw-in has ended. The ball may have been thrown-in, but if it hasn't been legally touched yet, it can still be corrected.

Hmmm. Let's switch this up a bit.

A is incorrectly given an AP throw in that should have gone to B. Before the pass is released, a) B1 commits a plane violation, or b) A2 fouls B2, or c) A1 reaches the ball across the plane and B1 ties the ball up.

You then realize the error.

In which, if any, situation(s) can you correct the error?

bainsey Thu Feb 02, 2012 03:10pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 819459)
A is incorrectly given an AP throw in that should have gone to B. Before the pass is released, a) B1 commits a plane violation, or b) A2 fouls B2, or c) A1 reaches the ball across the plane and B1 ties the ball up.

You then realize the error.

In all three cases, the throw-in was never complete. So, I have...
a) DOG, ball goes back to B.
b) team control foul on A2, ball goes back to B
c) ball goes back to B (the held ball doesn't change the arrow, as the throw-in never completed)

Some of this seems a bit counter-intuitive, but that's what I have.

PG_Ref Thu Feb 02, 2012 03:16pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by bainsey (Post 819474)
c) ball goes back to B (the held ball doesn't change the arrow, as the throw-in never completed)

Some of this seems a bit counter-intuitive, but that's what I have.

What if B was entitled to the arrow with the held ball?

Raymond Thu Feb 02, 2012 03:18pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by PG_Ref (Post 819477)
What if B was entitled to the arrow with the held ball?

B is entitled to arrow and he said B would get the throw-in.

PG_Ref Thu Feb 02, 2012 03:21pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef (Post 819478)
B is entitled to arrow and he said B would get the throw-in.

The scenario was that A had the ball for an AP arrow throw-in, and the ball not released yet ... did I have a brain fart?

bainsey Thu Feb 02, 2012 03:22pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef (Post 819478)
B is entitled to arrow and he said B would get the throw-in.

Right, but I believe PG is asking whether B would keep the arrow. It's a foul on A, so B gets the ball, and it's not an APTI.

In a) and c), however, I have the arrow switching after a completed throw-in.

PG_Ref Thu Feb 02, 2012 03:33pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by bainsey (Post 819481)

In a) and c), however, I have the arrow switching after a completed throw-in.

In a) , did the D.O.G. warning cause the throw-in to end? The throw-in team did not violate.

Raymond Thu Feb 02, 2012 03:34pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by PG_Ref (Post 819480)
The scenario was that A incorrectly had the ball for an AP arrow throw-in, and the ball not released yet ... did I have a brain fart?

Read my insert to your quote. :)

Sharpshooternes Thu Feb 02, 2012 03:36pm

This one is making my head hurt.

Duffman Thu Feb 02, 2012 03:38pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by bainsey (Post 819474)
In all three cases, the throw-in was never complete. So, I have...
a) DOG, ball goes back to B.
b) team control foul on A2, ball goes back to B
c) ball goes back to B (the held ball doesn't change the arrow, as the throw-in never completed)

Some of this seems a bit counter-intuitive, but that's what I have.

What did we decide was the cut off for that to be correctible? Was it at the end of the first throw in? Or was it prior to the ball being put in play. If it’s the former I’d argue that all three of those things ends the first throw in, and necessitates a second throw in (or potentially shots if B is in the bonus).

PG_Ref Thu Feb 02, 2012 03:42pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef (Post 819485)
Read my insert to your quote. :)

Agreed ... but we still have a held ball on an (incorrect) AP throw-in. Was the whistle blown for a held ball situation? If so, it determines what we have next.

Raymond Thu Feb 02, 2012 04:20pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by PG_Ref (Post 819491)
Agreed ... but we still have a held ball on an (incorrect) AP throw-in. Was the whistle blown for a held ball situation? If so, it determines what we have next.

On a held ball of this type (thrower sticks ball through plane) during an AP throw-in the next throw-in is an AP throw-in for the team which had the arrow. Team B had the arrow, but Team A was incorrectly given the throw-in. Therefore it is an AP throw-in for Team B.

bainsey Thu Feb 02, 2012 04:38pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by PG_Ref (Post 819483)
In a) , did the D.O.G. warning cause the throw-in to end? The throw-in team did not violate.

This is a good point, as it never was A's throw-in in the first place. Perhaps there's no DOG here.

Okay, so this opens up a can of worms. If you're B, and A has the throw-in incorrectly, should you just step over the line and cause a whistle, thereby getting the ball back when the mistake is realized (and no DOG)?

Adam Thu Feb 02, 2012 04:44pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duffman (Post 819489)
What did we decide was the cut off for that to be correctible? Was it at the end of the first throw in? Or was it prior to the ball being put in play. If it’s the former I’d argue that all three of those things ends the first throw in, and necessitates a second throw in (or potentially shots if B is in the bonus).

There is a rule for when a throw in ends. None of these situations qualify.

Adam Thu Feb 02, 2012 04:46pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by bainsey (Post 819508)
This is a good point, as it never was A's throw-in in the first place. Perhaps there's no DOG here.

Okay, so this opens up a can of worms. If you're B, and A has the throw-in incorrectly, should you just step over the line and cause a whistle, thereby getting the ball back when the mistake is realized (and no DOG)?

I'm giving B both.


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