Rebound throw/tip to back court- violation?

[Tee]

Here is the situation- A1 shoots, A2 rebounds with one hand, off balance, throws ball high in the air, into the backcourt, where it is recovered by A3.

Obviously there is no team control during shot, but at what point is team control re-established?

A2 had the ball very briefly, but I tend towards saying he had control or he would not have been able to direct it so strongly. On the other hand if he had control he could have passed it to a team mate. It was very close.

I am avoiding the point that he may have been over the plane of the end line to keep it simple, but I know (or think I know) that changes the situation.

How about if it were a controlled tip- (think volleyball spike)

The other problem in calling this one is that I was trail and ball was heaved from deep in the opposite corner- way out of my area of responsibility(much less vision).

I did not make the call, and allowed play to continue, as I had no definate knowledge of possesion. I did see the offensive player was the person who threw it, but it was just out of the corner of my eye.

Can the lead make the call? What is the common sense answer here? This was a adult rec leauge and no one objected to my no call...

If this were to occur in a school game and the coach is demanding a call, I want to know the answer.

[firedoc]

If A2 tapped the ball into the backcourt-no violation. If he caught the ball and then threw it into the backcourt - tweet...violation because team control was then established.

I'm not sure what you mean by him being over the plane of the endline. If his feet are inbounds he can certainly hold the ball over the endline without a violation occuring.

[RecRef]

This is a hard call to make even seeing it. A bat of the ball is not possession. So if A2 just swung his arm back and flung the ball I would say you made a good call. It is a pure judgment call most of the time and you are not going to please everyone. Nor is this answer going to please everyone as we have seen in the past for the same question.

[Mark Padgett]

Look - it's very simple - or is it? It depends on your definition of the word "hold".

You are correct that team control was lost on the shot. Team control is one of the four elements required for this call. During a period of no team control, team control is established when a player establishes player control. Player control is defined as a player holding or dribbling a live ball inbounds.

So, again - it boils down to your definition of "hold". Did the player hold the ball at any time or not. If you feel he did, you have a violation. If you feel he did not, you have no violation.

That's why we get the big bucks.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally posted by firedoc
If he caught the ball and then threw it into the backcourt - tweet...violation because team control was then established.

Actually,you need player control to establish the team control.Mark Padgett has an excellent explanation above.

[theboys]

To me, control in this case would be determined based on whether he intentionally directed the ball to his teammater, or the "throw/tap" was just a desperation attempt to keep the ball in play.

I think of it this way: A1 is trying to save a loose ball that's going out of bounds. He jumps, and while in the air over the out of bounds line, 1) with his back to the court, heaves the ball back into the court, and it happens to go into the backcourt, where A2 secures possession, or 2) turns in the air, catches the ball, and tosses it to his teammate in the backcourt. It seems to me 1) would be okay, and 2) would be a violation.

[Steve_pa]

I think a catch and throw in this situation would be a vioation if it was a volley ball type strike would be no violation. You said you couldn't see how it was thrown to half court so you were correct with no call.