Ten second vio. or time out

[bludevil1221]

The other night was working a JV Championship game. It was close the whole way. Three man crew, I was the R. Late in the fourth quarter. There was a crucial call. I was the C, partner at T counting in the backcourt signals a 10 sec violation and is preparing to give the ball to the other team. My other partner, at the L, runs up and says he has a time out on the bench. The partner at L never blew his whistle that either my partner nor myself heard, he said he blew it. The L and the T confer and award the time-out. The visiting fans and coach go nuts. I am across the courtas the C, and I am the referee, should I have stepped in and assisted with the decision. I wasn't sure what to do so I held my post since I had the only eyes on the court. Could someone let me know if as the R, should I have had a more dominant role in that decision. Just wondering....

Hope it's not too confusing!

[Mark Padgett]

In a case such as this, you (as R) should ask the lead if he is absolutely positive of all the following:

1) there was a clear verbal and/or visual TO request from the head coach on the bench that he recognized

2) his recognition came before the trail's count hit ten (there's no way he can know this, he can only know if it came before the trail blew his whistle - not the same thing)

3) he blew his whistle

If he can't verify all 3, then make the decision that the violation came first. Since he really can't know number 2 - there's your answer.

In any case, you should step in. At this level, getting the call right is a higher priority than watching the players at that time.

[LarryS]

In my opinion if the L says he blew his whistle and had granted a TO before the count got to 10 in the backcourt, the right decision was reached. You probably need to talk to the L about putting some air in his whistle.

As far as the visiting fans and coach going nuts, two questions?

1) How many were nuts before the game started?
2) How many had a real short trip to get there?

[mick]

Originally posted by bludevil1221
The other night was working a JV Championship game. It was close the whole way. Three man crew, I was the R. Late in the fourth quarter. There was a crucial call. I was the C, partner at T counting in the backcourt signals a 10 sec violation and is preparing to give the ball to the other team. My other partner, at the L, runs up and says he has a time out on the bench. The partner at L never blew his whistle that either my partner nor myself heard, he said he blew it. The L and the T confer and award the time-out. The visiting fans and coach go nuts. I am across the courtas the C, and I am the referee, should I have stepped in and assisted with the decision. I wasn't sure what to do so I held my post since I had the only eyes on the court. Could someone let me know if as the R, should I have had a more dominant role in that decision. Just wondering....

Hope it's not too confusing!

As C, you are there to assist. You were opposite and observing the benches from time to time, or you were very busy watching the players.
At what, exactly, were you looking? Could you have seen the request? Could you have seen there was no timely request.

[bludevil1221]

I never heard a request for TO. The L said that the coach didnt call the TO but a player did. The coach as I observed was sitting down. There was obviously a full-court press, and these kids were playing really hard. I am and was inclined to go by the ten sec violation. But the made a quick decision on the issue. The ref who called the ten sec violation went off the old trust your partner rule, and awarded the TO.

[Camron Rust]

If the lead says that he had a timeout before the 10 second whistle...I've got a timeout. It sounds like he clearly observed the two actions (TO request and heard the trail's whistle for the 10 seconds) and determined that he heard/saw the TO request first. Only mistake is not coming out hard on the whistle to get everyone's attention.

[Peter Devana]

Totally agree with the last post

[ChuckElias]

Camron nailed it.

[Mark Padgett]

Wait just a gosh-darned minute here. The original post said the lead had a "timeout on the bench". Then we find out it wasn't the head coach but a player request.

Guess what? We don't recognize timeout requests from players on the bench.

[Paul LeBoutillier]

Originally posted by Mark Padgett
The original post said the lead had a "timeout on the bench". Then we find out it wasn't the head coach but a player request.

Guess what? We don't recognize timeout requests from players on the bench.

A fine piece of investigative work Mark!

[ChuckElias]

Originally posted by Mark Padgett
Guess what? We don't recognize timeout requests from players on the bench.

That's b/c there are no players on the bench. Team members on the bench are considered substitutes

[rainmaker]

Originally posted by Mark Padgett
Wait just a gosh-darned minute here. The original post said the lead had a "timeout on the bench". Then we find out it wasn't the head coach but a player request.

Guess what? We don't recognize timeout requests from players on the bench.

Maybe bluedevil didn't mean that the coach called it. Maybe "on the bench" just meant "that team requested a time-out."

Bluedevil -- can you clarify?

[Mark Padgett]

Originally posted by rainmaker

Maybe bluedevil didn't mean that the coach called it.

I hope he didn't mean that, since you know coaches cannot call timeouts, Juulie.

Remember, we have 3 games together this Saturday, but I can always switch you to 3rd grade girls.