Transition
 

I know there's no absolutes or always to what we do, but over the past 3 summers I've heard different opinions on slot to slot positioning in transition.

1. Trail the pack to have a mini T view (DI-M official I work HS games for)
2. Even with the pack to be on top of the play (HS decision makers)
3. Ahead of the pack to receive the play (NBA/DII-W supervisors)

Which do you use & why?

Approximately even with the second to last defender. OR, about 2/3 of the way back in the pack.

#2 for me but I think only #3 has a good chance of causing you to be in a bad position.

Thanks guys!

Bob, why do you trail the play, do you not think the T can referee 3 players?

I prefer 2 over 1 but why do say 3 would cause us to be in bad position?

I'm with #2.

I do hate when I'm watching games on TV and #1 is employed but instead of watching the pack the Center is looking back at the ball. See it a lot in Big 12 games.

IKR! The new L is watching 7 players but the slot is gonna get that illegal dribble should the T miss it :(

At a camp I recently attended they showed us video of all 3. On film:

1. Looked slow & lazy, chasing the play down. No disrespect to anyone that practices that technique. Ideally, the T should be refereeing the one on one matchup through to the next layer.

2. Showed how clustered it can be for us & how things are missed as we are caught trying to see through players.

3. Not only showed hustle & athleticism but it follows the L principles of refereeing back, being in position to accept the play & there were more open looks through the pack.

I'm going to experiment with 2 & 3 to see which works best for me.

Who said I trail the play? I wasn't talking about a double team in the BC and the rest of the players in the FC. I was talking about a "pack" of players moving down the court

Does "back" not mean "trail" here?

I'd interpret it means 6 players ahead of you and 4 behind you. It doesn't mention where the ball is. If there are 4 players in the backcourt, I'd expect that the ball was still there too and his position seems about right. However, if the ball was thrown down court on a quick outlet, I'd expect he'd get ahead of the "pack" to help cover the 2+2 attacking the basket. No one right position for every play.

Let's start over. Describe the play. Where is the ball and where are the other players? I think we're envisioning different things.

In transition, the C has responsibilities that make #3 a disadvantageous position. The L receives the play, the C stays with the pack and the T is trailing the play(ers). That is a desirable balance and makes the best use of six eyes. Personally, I would try to use #2 all the time, but I could be slightly behind the pack. I just don't see a situation where I would be in front of the pack.

That would be "trailing" the pack, no?

Are you really Bobs attorney or do you just play one on the internet? j/k :D

Thats why I said from the jump:


Transition in general Bob, missed attempt & defensive rebound or a made basket. No press, one on one in the b/c... are you beating the pack, even with it or trailing the pack & why?

You're already in position, not on the run or chasing & it provides more open looks than being even with pack.

I'm confused because you started out asking a question and have now taken a position, both on the court and in this discussion. You can do what is best for you, but I'm not going to make it a habit of beating the largest pack of players down the court.

It seems like your discussion at camp focused on how the official looked more than what position the officials were in. There are probably an infinite number of plays you can look at where each of the three are in position to see some of the plays, but at the same time are stacked on others.

Since I live in Vegas I will say the odds are the L has two players, the T has two players and the C has six. That being the case - without scientific evidence at all - do you think you are going to get stacked with those six? Not a trick question, looking for your opinion.

What if there is a block charge on the far sideline, at the division line, and the C was looking good and hustled down to the free throw line extended? Again, looking for your opinion.

As a basketball official, hustle mean nothing to me. Getting into the best position to make accurate calls means everything. That means sometimes we will walk, sometimes we will sprint and sometimes we will stand still. Think about it, an evaluator can tell you that you ran yourself into a bad (stacked) position when you are hustling, but not when you are in the best position.

YMMV

I hear you tomegun. I'm not here to "tell" anybody what they should do, just discussion.
We discuss rules, plays & management of the game often. Rarely do we discuss positioning & more importantly "why" we do what we do.

Difference of opinions on how to work the slot has confused me over the last couple years. So I thought I would see how differently forum members worked the position. Nothing more, nothing less.

Can the slot who has 6 players in transition ever be stacked? Sometimes.

Block/charge at the division line far side... what is T looking at? And the slot should be open & available to assist if need be. A T&T perhaps but we all know how to close on those must haves.

T is looking at the offensive player's backside - stacked most of the time.

Well IMO those are just bad basic fundamentals tomegun. We should position adjust to obtain/maintain open looks. We move to improve by using "2 & 2" to achieve this as T.

Go where you need to go to officiate the play or players. This is not a one size fits all answer anyway. Sometimes you are behind, sometimes you were with them. It really depends on what is happening with the ball and how much pressure is in the backcourt. Do not over complicate this.

Peace

Cliche much? :D

I agree 100% with tomegun.
(I can also tell you that he is one of the top instructors in the Vegas area.)
The key is to get an angle to see the play. That means that you adjust to the players. I see this idea as similar to the home positions which are taught in 3-person. You come down the court with getting to your home position as your target, but you aren't locked into that spot. You must be willing to adjust from it or if you need to go somewhere else for a good reason, then you go there.

So now I'm back and my position is what the others have said. THe "pack" is a fairly large area. I'm (ingeneral) not right in the middle of it. I'm toward the back, but not trailing it. :shrug:

Really? A1, because of pressure from B1, throws a 20ft pass to the division line, along the Trail's sideline, to A2 who immediately turns and crashes with B2.

You're saying the Trail should have morphed up court to see the play?

Do you think a Center official who ran up ahead of the pack will now be able to look back through the pack to see the crash?

if everyone in the rotation is on top of things the three man transition mechanics cover the court well enough if you use your brain and get good angles while your getting down the court a "crash" will be officiated.................................im not directing this at badnews just everyone MYSELF included

I don't even know what this is suppose to mean as it relates to the thread...:confused:

I am glad it was not just me. :eek:

Peace

in transition the L, the C, and the T all have a certain spot they are supposed be in correct?

Correct...the discussion in this thread is where should the C should be located in relation to the players. Tref has heard three different philosophies from different sources (all relating to the level of which the different sources work at) and is wondering our opinions as to which one is best in our opinion.

Right. Or A2 catches the ball right near the division line and (perhaps) steps over it or passes the ball to someone who is coming from BC, or in the air coming from FC .... That call is the centers.

Maybe another way to put it. C needs to be in a position to work 2-man with L on a long pass and breakout, and work 2-man with T on any sort of press or pressure during the transition. And, be able to go from one to the other in short order.

Okay, okay you changed the scenario on me, now its block/charge on an outlet pass.
I did lead off with no absolutes or always...

Of course we have to have a feel for what may happen "next" & be in position to make the call. Reading a step ahead is what I try to accomplish.

In the new sitch, when A1 gets possession I'm side stepping a couple times in the slot as I read the play. I'm NEVER said A gets the rebound & I'm gone like a L. I see the pressure by B1 then I'm looking to the bench for a t/o & I'm most definitely gonna notice A2 curling back to the division line for an outlet pass. 8 players headed north & 2 players in reverse is a red-flag for me.

My problem with this is how often does a C "receive a play"? The Lead does because he has plays to the basket and secondary defenders. The C is supposed to be getting angles to see between players and looking for competitive matchup.

Also, #3 is from the NBA guys for a reason. They have a 24-second shot clock and rarely any backcourt pressure to deal with. The ball gets inside the 3-point line a lot faster in the Pro game than it does in college or HS ball. So #3 doesn't really apply to the amateur game, IMO (unless you have an old school UNLV/LMU game going on).

Makes sense BNR!

And there you have it folks, I guess its best to be versatile in the slot, sometimes this & other times that.

Thanks to all for playing!

I was taught that the C in transition should try to be in position to referee the "next pass" - or to be where he can officiate the player that will be getting that pass and the defender(s) who will be picking him up. So running down and setting up at the far end is a bad idea. Trailing the pack is a bad idea...find the happy medium. It will be different from game to game, and quite often from transition to transition within the same game. There is no "set" place to be...that's why officiating is an "art", not a "science".