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Tue Dec 24, 2002, 11:24am
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NFHS game last night where A1 starts his shooting motion to attempt a set shot. B1 blocks the shot so that it cannot be released and the ball is suspended; and would definetly be a held ball if this was a jump shot. However I am wondering if the fact that the shot attempt was a set shot where the shooter did not leave the floor has any bearing on calling this a jump ball?
thanks again GTW 
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Tue Dec 24, 2002, 11:28am
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No effect. If the ball was prevented from being released, it is a "held ball" go to the arrow for possession. If the ball was released, even microscopically, and the blocked back into the shooter's hands, it is a blocked shot, NOT TRAVELLING, although occasionally you'll see someone call it this way. Incidentally, even if the ball-handler isn't shooting, but is just passing, if the ball is prevented from being released, it is a "held ball". AP. I'm using strictly NF rules.
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Tue Dec 24, 2002, 03:14pm
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re: definetly not traveling
thanks for the reply. To clarify it would indeed be a held ball, not a "no call" when a set shot is blocked and prevented from being released, right?
Merry Christmas!!! GTW
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Wed Dec 25, 2002, 03:26am
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Read the rule!
Sorry guys, this does not fit the definition of held ball.
4-25 Held Ball A held ball occurs when: Art. 1...Opponents have their hands so firmly on the ball that control cannot be obtained without undue roughness. Art. 2...An opponent places his/her hand(s) on the ball and prevents an airborne player from throwing the ball or releasing it on a try. The situation at hand does not seem to fit into article 1 and clearly does not fall under article 2 since this part specifies airborne player.
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Wed Dec 25, 2002, 11:27am
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I agree, it's a held ball.
__________________
"...as cool as the other side of the pillow." - Stuart Scott "You should never be proud of doing the right thing." - Dean Smith
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Wed Dec 25, 2002, 01:29pm
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Quote:
 says it's a held ball,too.
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Thu Dec 26, 2002, 10:49am
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Re: Read the rule!
Quote:
 But that's just me and the evaluators at the camps I attended this summer.
__________________
I didn't say it was your fault...I said I was going to blame you.
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Thu Dec 26, 2002, 10:58am
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Re: clarification
Quote:
There is no clear case or rule that it is a held ball if the feet are still on the floor. As there is a rule and case if the shooter is airborne. So I go with no held ball. The problem is, for me, if the big paw of the defender is actually holding/around the ball as the shot is being taken but the shooter retains the ball after the block. What is it then? Then if you want to say it is a held ball on a shot than what about a pass?
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Thu Dec 26, 2002, 03:01pm
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Easy jump ball call. If you don't make a call, then what? Now both teams are yelling for a time out, who do you give it to? Don't be too pure call it a jump. That is what a WNBA official told me this summer. Neither coach will have a problem with it and obviously we won't either.
__________________
~Hodges My two sense! 
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Fri Dec 27, 2002, 06:44am
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Those of you who don't call this play according to the rule are making it difficult for those of us that do. You are failing to educate the players and coaches on the proper rules of the game by calling this way.
Now LarryS and I disagree about whether or not this play meets the requirements of article 1, but that is fine. At least he is justifying his call with part of the rule. This so-and-so told me to call a held ball on this play so the coaches won't complain rationale is nonsense. Your duty as an official is to follow the rule.
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Fri Dec 27, 2002, 09:01am
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This seems to be a subject that is called differently in my area as well. In HS (FED) games I will call a held ball any time the shooter is prevented from releasing the ball while in the air (as long as there is not body contact before or at the same time the held ball occurs. IMO you are rewarding the defense for making a clean play in this situation and not bailing out the offense by making a no call or calling the sometimes "phantom" foul. For a player on the ground trying to go up with a shot or making a pass, if they are prevented from releasing the ball (it does not immediately get "stolen" by the defense or fall to the floor, is this not a held ball as well?? IMO the offensive player then has to attempt to "rip" the ball away from the defender and IMO that can be thought of as undue roughness. I do see a lot of ref's in my area call this differently. BUt I personally have very few coaches who have issues with it being called this way. Just my thoughts....
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Fri Dec 27, 2002, 11:26am
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I'm new to this board, so go easy on me.
I always thought that the intent of the rule about calling a held ball when an airborne player was prevented from releasing a shot was to ptotect the offense from an up and down violation. The held ball call at least gives the ball back to the offense half the time. As such, a blocked shot against a player still on the floor would not automatically be a held ball unless the defense demonstrates some kind of control of the ball.SamC
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Fri Dec 27, 2002, 11:44am
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Quote:
Welcome to the Hoops side! You do such a fine job on the "Diamond", I am pleased to have you here. The intent, I believe, in all cases is to reward the defense for a good, clean play. When a defender prevents the release of the ball for a try, or merely a pass, the act is rewarded with a held ball. No control has to be shown other than the offensive player being unable to get the ball off their own hand. ...A sort of stalemate. mick
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