IHSAA Sectional Fight What should happen

[purduegrad]

What are your thoughts?

IndyStar Link

Penalties coming for sectional fight | The Indianapolis Star | indystar.com

Youtube of Fight:

YouTube - North Central & Lawrence North fight; Michael Chandler & Tim Bass ejected - 3/4/11

[JRutledge]

What should happen is up to the state organization. I am sure the video will help identify players beyond what was reported who should be suspended or what should be done ultimately. We are officials, we do not decide what happens beyond the game we are working.

Peace

[Bad Zebra]

Originally Posted by purduegrad

What are your thoughts?

My first thought is "I'm glad I wasn't working that game".
My second thought is "I hope the state comes down extremely hard on any player that participated in the fight and any player that left the bench and came on the floor during the incident".
My third thought is "I hope the state comes down extremely hard on the school for failing to keep spectators off the floor during the incident". It doesn't appear there was ANY crowd control.

It's bad enough the officials have to contend with the nonsense from the players. Add the crowd to the mix and you've got a recipe for disaster.

[JugglingReferee]

I don't see anyone left on the benches. Looks like an early night.

[Bad Zebra]

Originally Posted by JugglingReferee

I don't see anyone left on the benches. Looks like an early night.

Can't really tell. By the time the camera panned over to the fight, looks like there was a small pile already on the floor. No telling where they came from. Hopefully there's better footage for the state to review because you really can't see who started what from the link in the OP.

[26 Year Gap]

They continued with the game according to the score on the video and what the final score ended up as, which is surprising. Benches do appear to be empty. HTBT but it might be possible that somebody in the semis gets a bye.

[stir22]

So, what do you guys do if a fight breaks out in a game you are officiating? Our association tells us not to intervene; to let the coaches handle it. I've gotten between players after a hard foul, or when they are getting kind of chippy- but have never been in a game where an actual fight breaks out. Any experience here?

/thanks

[Adam]

You can try to prevent it by getting between them, but once they start swinging, just blow your whistle, stand back, and remember numbers.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by stir22

So, what do you guys do if a fight breaks out in a game you are officiating? Our association tells us not to intervene; to let the coaches handle it. I've gotten between players after a hard foul, or when they are getting kind of chippy- but have never been in a game where an actual fight breaks out. Any experience here?

/thanks

Thankfully, not yet.

We did have a technical foul on Saturday where a player shoved another player after an out-of-bounds and my partner called a technical foul. An opponent really wanted to clap and whoop that up, but I was on him before anyone could even think he deserved a technical or, more importantly the situation escalated.

I would never get in the middle of a fight. I need to observe and record numbers (even if just in my mind) and I have my own safety to consider, too.

[Fiji07]

Two players who started the fight were ejected. No one else from either team was ejected during that game. This was the semi-final game, North Central(white) ended up winning and won the championship game the next night. Only the one player involved in the fight to start with was suspended for the next game. Could end up with more suspensions depending on the review from the state.

[purduegrad]

Form Indystar.com
North Central's D'Vauntes Smith-Rivera suspended for Saturday's game | The Indianapolis Star | indystar.com

[rockyroad]

Purduegrad, were you there? Did you see the fight?

Asking because, at the start of the video, there are two players on the ground in the key at the opposite end of the court from the fight. Are those the same two that got into the fight?

Seems like - without being there and not having the entire video - this could MAYBE have been prevented if the L (new T) had stayed with those two players who got involved at the other end. Maybe not - always the possibility they would have gone at it anyway...but coming up the court, just get between them and keep them apart.

[purduegrad]

Originally Posted by rockyroad

Purduegrad, were you there? Did you see the fight?

Asking because, at the start of the video, there are two players on the ground in the key at the opposite end of the court from the fight. Are those the same two that got into the fight?

Seems like - without being there and not having the entire video - this could MAYBE have been prevented if the L (new T) had stayed with those two players who got involved at the other end. Maybe not - always the possibility they would have gone at it anyway...but coming up the court, just get between them and keep them apart.

I was not there, but that too was my initial thought.

[efbyon]

Of course, I am speculating since obviously I was not there...

I am guessing that the reason why the bench personnel that came onto the court were not disqualified was because the officials could not determine who among those in the melee were bench personnel at the time. The fans coming onto the floor certainly did not help the situation. By rule, the bench personnel that came onto the floor that did not participate in the fight (it looked as if all the "extra" people on the floor were trying to break up the fight, so I would say they were not actually participating in the fight, but I could be wrong since the video may not have told the whole story) should have been assessed flagrant T's and become disqualified, with the head coach being assessed one indirect T (hopefull BillyMac or someone else can provide the rule reference since I don't have my books on me right now).

Another possibility: the officials may have been able to figure out who came off the bench during the melee, or at least some of them, but given that the bench people were trying to act like peacemakers (or so it appeared; again, the video may have not told the whole story), the officials opted not to assess any further T's. If this was the case, then I probably would have informed both HC's what the rule is so that they would know in the event they get involved in a similar situation in the future. There's that chance they could get an official(s) in the future that might be more stringent with enforcing the rules, so the coaches would be better off knowing than not knowing.

I would love to be able to access a TV monitor to determine who should be ejected, but as most of us know, Federation rules currently do not allow that, unlike NCAA. I would not be surprised if that subject gets tabled for discussion in the future, though.

But I think there is still a lesson to be learned here: in situations such as this, one of the officials should act as an observer to determine who came onto the floor during the fight so that the appropriate action can be taken on those that did it, while the other official(s) tries to break up the fight.

Fred

[Adam]

Sorry, but if there's a fight, one official better look at the benches to make sure no one is leaving. If I look over and the bench is cleared, everyone is done. If it's mostly cleared, I'll remember the numbers of the players still on the bench, as they'll be the only ones not DQd.