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-   -   6 players on the court - what would you do? (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/6423-6-players-court-what-would-you-do.html)

Jurassic Referee Thu Dec 05, 2002 12:25pm
Great post above,Nevada Ref
 
1)You win a "Slappy". Congratulations!
2)Just as a kinda rebuttal,and I don't mean to be mean or anything,but R10-1-6 says "have more than five team members participating simultaneously". That would be eight(8) words,as I count 'em.
3)http://www.gifs.net/animate/icecave.gif
:D

JugglingReferee Thu Dec 05, 2002 05:22pm
Re: 1st of 2 FTs?
 
And in fact, in this situation, since no time comes off the clock, does a "Rudy" type player actually get listed as being a participant in the game?


Mike


Quote:
Originally posted by Richard Ogg
How about this escape?

What happens if you notice the 6 players after you give the ball to the shooter for the first of 2 free throws. You could swallow your whistle, let the player shoot, recover the ball, and THEN discover the 6th player. At that point the ball is dead so there is no T. (Besides, standing and watching someone shoot a free throw where there will be no rebound is not very active in the participation department.)

If there is only 1 shot, or it is the second shot, then you must give the T.

JugglingReferee Thu Dec 05, 2002 05:22pm
Re: 1st of 2 FTs?
 
I love this out!

Quote:
Originally posted by Richard Ogg
How about this escape?

What happens if you notice the 6 players after you give the ball to the shooter for the first of 2 free throws. You could swallow your whistle, let the player shoot, recover the ball, and THEN discover the 6th player. At that point the ball is dead so there is no T. (Besides, standing and watching someone shoot a free throw where there will be no rebound is not very active in the participation department.)

If there is only 1 shot, or it is the second shot, then you must give the T.

JugglingReferee Thu Dec 05, 2002 05:56pm
Quote:
Originally posted by Jurassic Referee
Quote:
Originally posted by JugglingReferee
Nada.

Of course, I check on every play, and some day one will get by me. However, in the sitch that was described, there has been no real disadvantage. Ok, maybe the shooter was iced a bit, but there was no up-and-down the court action.

What if one referee's hand was up and the other bounced the ball to the shooter prematurely. This is a ref's mistake. As is the ref bringing in the subs allowing 11 on the court.

If I screw up, I try not to penalize the kids playing the game.
The team that had 6 players on the court is the party that screwed up.

No disadvantage?One team has 6 players on the court during a live ball-you ignore it-and you haven't disadvantaged the OTHER team(not to mention ignoring a clearly written rule)? How can you possibly explain your way out of this one,if the coach puts in a complaint to the league about it? We don't get to pick and choose the rules we administer due to like or dislike.

There's always 2 teams on the court,and you have to be fair to both of them.
It happened on the front end of 2 FTs. Sure it's a live ball, and I hope that I'm quick enough to think to myself to "notice" to infraction during the dead ball period following the first shot. Seeing how nothing happens to the ball after the first shot, other than it being dead, I guess the disadvantage to B is that A has one more player on the court that could commit a free throw violation, and hence ruin their first shot.

But to call a T. No way. I don't care if I'm being evaluated. I'm certain that there will be other things in my game, more legitimate, that an evaluator will comment on.

Mike

Jurassic Referee Thu Dec 05, 2002 06:41pm
Quote:
Originally posted by JugglingReferee
[/B]
It happened on the front end of 2 FTs. Sure it's a live ball, and I hope that I'm quick enough to think to myself to "notice" to infraction during the dead ball period following the first shot. Seeing how nothing happens to the ball after the first shot, other than it being dead, I guess the disadvantage to B is that A has one more player on the court that could commit a free throw violation, and hence ruin their first shot.

But to call a T. No way. I don't care if I'm being evaluated. I'm certain that there will be other things in my game, more legitimate, that an evaluator will comment on.

Mike [/B][/QUOTE]Mike,do you really think that NOT giving B two extra FT"s,plus a possession,isn't really putting them at a disadvantage? If B loses the game by a point,are you telling me that your evaluator isn't gonna mention that little fact to you?Do you really think that the B coach isn't gonna be writing a 10 page diatribe on this,if he loses?Do you still believe in the Easter Bunny?:D

I don't think that anyone on this board(except for maybe a few closet sociopaths)really want to call a T in this case.I'm guessing that the great majority(and I'm one of them)really hate the idea of having to call one.The problem is the rulebook doesn't give us the option of NOT calling one,unless you're quick enough to play with the live ball/dead ball aspect.Even then,you're still screwing B.JMO.

Dan_ref Thu Dec 05, 2002 08:39pm
Quote:
Originally posted by Jurassic Referee
Quote:
Originally posted by JugglingReferee
It happened on the front end of 2 FTs. Sure it's a live ball, and I hope that I'm quick enough to think to myself to "notice" to infraction during the dead ball period following the first shot. Seeing how nothing happens to the ball after the first shot, other than it being dead, I guess the disadvantage to B is that A has one more player on the court that could commit a free throw violation, and hence ruin their first shot.

But to call a T. No way. I don't care if I'm being evaluated. I'm certain that there will be other things in my game, more legitimate, that an evaluator will comment on.

Mike [/B]
Mike,do you really think that NOT giving B two extra FT"s,plus a possession,isn't really putting them at a disadvantage? If B loses the game by a point,are you telling me that your evaluator isn't gonna mention that little fact to you?Do you really think that the B coach isn't gonna be writing a 10 page diatribe on this,if he loses?Do you still believe in the Easter Bunny?:D

I don't think that anyone on this board(except for maybe a few closet sociopaths)really want to call a T in this case.I'm guessing that the great majority(and I'm one of them)really hate the idea of having to call one.The problem is the rulebook doesn't give us the option of NOT calling one,unless you're quick enough to play with the live ball/dead ball aspect.Even then,you're still screwing B.JMO. [/B][/QUOTE]

Closet sociopath...not me...no sireee...

http://www.gifs.net/animate/asspump.gif

Jurassic Referee Thu Dec 05, 2002 08:52pm
Quote:
Originally posted by Dan_ref
[/B]
Closet sociopath...not me...no sireee...

http://www.gifs.net/animate/asspump.gif [/B][/QUOTE]You're never one to point a finger,eh?:D

Btw,Slider's back. You going to the party?

Dan_ref Thu Dec 05, 2002 08:57pm
Quote:
Originally posted by Jurassic Referee

Btw,Slider's back. You going to the party?
Sure...you bringin' the rope?

Jurassic Referee Thu Dec 05, 2002 09:08pm
Re: Re: 1st of 2 FTs?
 
Quote:
Originally posted by JugglingReferee
And in fact, in this situation, since no time comes off the clock, does a "Rudy" type player actually get listed as being a participant in the game?
Nope-unless he stays in the game as one of the legal 5 participants.It's a team T-Rudy can't get directly charged with one,either.

Nevadaref Fri Dec 06, 2002 02:50am
Quote:
Originally posted by Jurassic Referee
I don't mean to be mean or anything,but R10-1-6 says "have more than five team members participating simultaneously".
[/B]
Well, as usual, you are right, JR!
So much for my legal career.
I guess the only bright side from my work is a possible definition of "participating" for 10-1-6.
I would say that a team member is participating when he/she is a player. Then my post makes some sense.
Unfortunately, the NFHS just doesn't give a definition and having one in my own little basketball world isn't good enough.

Jurassic Referee Fri Dec 06, 2002 05:21am
Quote:
Originally posted by Nevadaref
I guess the only bright side from my work is a possible definition of "participating" for 10-1-6.
[/B][/QUOTE]Oh no,the real bright side is that you are now eligible to win one of this year's coveted "Slappy" awards.That would make you immortal forever!

Immortal forever?? I can't believe that I wrote that,but I'm leaving 'er in! Must have got that from the famous "Department of Redundancy Department". :D


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