Disconcerting
 

My attempt to improve my postings.

Had a coach of a junior high team ask me about a player yelling: "Miss It!" while A) sitting on the and B) while in the game as the FT shooter was attempting.

Under rule 9.1.c and in the case book (9.1.3), I think I can assume this is certain to be disconcerting and be called a violation.

However, can this also be call unsportinglike from the bench and issued a warning and/or a technical foul?

Any help to this coach on educating him of this rule ... thanks! Hope that was a better post.

Delayed violation- if missed reshoot the free throw and tell violator that they're in violation and knock it off!

Delayed violation- if made, count shot and tell violator they're in violation and knock it off.

If it continues, then whack!

Usually the knock it off handles it with the kids.

Yes, it's disconcertion from both locations.

Depending on the level of ball, I've called it and warned others.

Never issued a T on the bench though.

At a minimum, it's disconcerting. If the player does it again, instruct the coach that a further incident will results in an unsportsmanlike technical foul. This action by the non-shooters is approaching making a travesty of the game.

Your a good sport Johnny. :) And yes, this is the kind of post I expect from a veteran official.

As for rulings. Bench personnel will get a warning the first time and a T subsequently.

Disconcertion in both A and B.

If they don't get the message, then it continues to be disconcertion. The coach will shut them down pretty quickly.

If the first basket is made, then I'm telling them to knock it off (the exact way of delivering this will depend on the game) so they know -- they probably didn't see the extended arm.

Thanks! :)

Much of this is what I told the coach. Just wanted to see if there was anymore that could be added ... he views this thread. So, all of your input was helpful.

Exactly. No matter how many times he does it, it's disconcertion. It's not a technical foul.

You're a good sport too.

I'm not.

If they continue to do it after being warned, I'm "T"ing 'em up in a hearbeat for unsporting behavior. If you don't, there's no use of warning them in the first place. I won't let them make a farce out of the game with repeated violations. And I've got very specific instructions from the NFHS to back me up. From the 2001-02 rule book:

POE #2 Disconcertion During Free Throw:
"The committe emphasizes that disconcertion is a violation and may result in a substitute throw. If persistent or deemed unsporting, the team/player may be penalized with a technical foul.

So, help me out. What are your limits to actions by the bench personnel during a free-throw, in regards to disconcertation? Sometimes they're just making noise, yelling "hey-ey-ey, and so forth."

+1

"Persistent or unsporting": I treat these separately. Persistent disconcerting gets a warning. If I have to call a subsequent technical foul, it's for ignoring the warning, not the disconcertion per se.

Unsporting disconcertion would be shouting an obscenity or epithet or the like. That warrants an immediate T without warning.

I use discretion here. I don't mind players and coaches talking, etc.

But, if I feel that they are doing it just before the player is about to shoot, for the purpose of "messing" with (disconcerting) the shooter, I will call it.

For example, right as the shooter goes to take his shot, the kid next to him yells really loud, "I got shooter!" My arm goes out.

But, it the player would do that as normal conversation, and stop before the player shoots, I've got nothing.

If the coach or bench players are yelling or yapping, I got nothing. But, if they do it right before the shooter shoots just to disturb him and throw off his concentration, I'll put my hand out.

Sorta OT
 

Had a game today where this subject came up. The place was paced with a dozen fans......
Twice during FT's in the first half a fans cell phone went off. It was loud but had a good beat. The question was--- would this fall under an artificial noise maker and should we have called a disconcertion on the FT? Both times the FT went in and it only happened once in the second half. Just got me curious.

Thanks. I do a lot of mentoring of young officials, and this subject hasn't come up lately. Your response regarding bench personnel is the part I really needed.
BTW, this forum is great! The answers, references, and the humor have cost me a lot of hours of sleep this season, because I just can't hit the sack without reviewing every subject and post. But it's well worth it to me. Thanks, again!

Don't even think about it.

Yes, you could call it an artificial noisemaker. No, you can't call disconcertion on anyone but an opponent, by rule. You can get game management to get rid of the artificial noisemaker if you want.

I think discretion is the better part of valor and probably wouldn't call it an artifical noisemaker. Just an odd occurance. Usually, this gym is packed and loud so it was sort of odd to have THAT small a crowd.
I DID like the ringtone, but refrained from asking her who it was!

Okay, I can live with that. But posters are saying they're going to assess a T the second time it happens. I don't buy that.

I've NEVER had it more than once when calling disconcertion.

However, a don't think a POE from 2001 is very specific instruction. If this is what the NFHS wants, then it needs to appear in the rule book or case book every year.

My thought on this is if it is coming from the bench a warning (along with the violation if missed) and then a second time should be a tech.

I'm going to be a bit more deliberate on this. I don't typically give warnings for delayed violations when the shot is made. I've done it once in an AAU game (player behind the shooter yelling just as shot was taken) and the little sh1t tried to argue with me.

If they don't see (or understand) my extended arm; not my problem. If the other coach asks, I'll tell him what's going on.

If I do get the chance to call disconcertion, and they do it again from the bench, then I'll warn them. "Coach, you need to keep your bench under control before they end up costing you."

One warning only, of course.

I've had this coming from the opposing coach, yelling "box out" on the first of two FTs. btw, the coach in question was also a rec official. Never worked with him before or since...

That coach knows exactly what he's doing. Just like players know exactly what they're doing when they conveniently tell each other who they have on defense while the shooter is about to shoot.

I have had to stop grade school kids on the opposing bench from stomping their feet or making comments and/or noise. Had cheerleaders in grade school stomp their feet too, but I ignored it.

Warned 1, violation on another in same game...
 

B3 on the lane is holding his arms in the lane in front of himself,shaking his hands like he just washed them. (6 grade Boys Quad-A so Im pretty sure hand washing is out of the question lol.) Shooter makes basket so I have nothing, but since I'm L, before I give ball to shooter for second shot, I ask B3 if there is something wrong with his hands... Gives me the sheepish look, says "no they're good", and I briefly explain if he is shaking them for the sole purpose of distracting the shooter its called "disconcertion" and is just like a lane violation.
Problem solved. He knew what he was up to, and I had to laugh when he turns to the shooter and apologizes lol.

Later at the other end, B is on the FT-line, and A3 on the lane waits till shooter starts his motion, then begins rapidly clapping his hands together in the lane while saying "la-la-la-lah" :> Shooter misses, I award another FT and explain it again to all present. Once again I get a good laugh, A1 and A2 are telling A3 "Yeah you can't do that, remember earlier down there? We can't """Discredit""" them while they are shooting."

Refuse to do Wreck-Ball all you want, but its moments like this that keep you coming back for more. They learned a new rule, even if they can't pronounce it yet, and I got a couple of chuckles good enough to, momentarily, forget my aching right knee. Gotta love it. :D

Been there... done that with the grade schoolers. Yes I find doing grade school is low stress and can be comical. We try to teach (not coach) when we are out there and I have been told by parents and coaches they appreciate our help with their kids. Just last week during throw-in at 5th grade game, player steps over the line before he throws in. I call the violation and explain to him what he did wrong. He sheepishly looks and me and says, "I'm sorry." I smile and say, "You'll be OK."

Reverse Disconcertion?
 

Bounced the ball to the shooter tonight and in a whisper, the kid in the lane closest to him in a hushed tone, says, "I've got shooter."

I thought of you guys and this thread!?

I gotta get a life! :p

1 warning. If it interrupted the shot then re shoot. Any more after the first warning T. Unsportsmanlike conduct/behavior.