NCAA FT question

[ChuckElias]

This was from my NCAA refresher test. I've already sent it in, but would like to hear what everybody thinks.

B1 fouls A1. Team A is in the bonus. B1 then curses at A1. Official assesses a technical foul. Officials then allow the FTs to be shot in wrong order. They shoot the 1-and-1 first (A1 makes both), then shoot the technical FTs. The officials then realize the error and give Team B possession of the ball for a throw-in anywhere along the endline. Is the official correct?

Dan and I talked about this. Our initial agreement was that since A1 made both ends of the 1-and-1, you know who should get the ball after the FTs. So the official did the best thing he could do. You give it B b/c they would've had the ball if the FTs had been shot in the correct order.

After Dan had already mailed his test in, I talked to a couple local guys who convinced me that after the FTs for the technical, you have to put the ball in play at the POI, which in this case is a point where neither team has control. So you would have to use the arrow. So I answered that the official was not correct.

Any thoughts on this. . .Bob?

chuck

[Tim Roden]

I have not read an NCAA rule book, but it would make sense to me to: if both free throws of the one and one are made to give the ball to team b with the base line. If he misses one of the free throws then go with the AP arrow under the basket for a spot throw in. Which after rereading your post is what you said is correct.

The other option would be a correctible error where the points are errased and you shot the one and one again, this time with everyone one on the line. I don't like this option and would rather go with the one above.

[ChuckElias]

Originally posted by Tim Roden
The other option would be a correctible error where the points are errased and you shot the one and one again,

It doesn't fit any of the errors in 2-10. It's not the wrong player, it's not the wrong basket, it's not unmerited. We talked about that possibility, but I don't think you could do it that way.

[mick]

Originally posted by ChuckElias

It doesn't fit any of the errors in 2-10. It's not the wrong player, it's not the wrong basket, it's not unmerited. We talked about that possibility, but I don't think you could do it that way.

Chuck,
I think we can interpolate it from 2-10-a. Failing to award a merited free throw:

The technical throws were merited, but not awarded. Thus, we award them, within the allowable time frame, and point of interuption is Team B on the endline.
mick

[ChuckElias]

Originally posted by mick

The technical throws were merited, but not awarded. Thus, we award them, within the allowable time frame, and point of interuption is Team B on the endline.
mick

I don't see how you could make that case, mick. The officials realized the error immediately following the technical free throws. So they were merited and they were awarded. If you catch it before shooting the technical FTs then maybe you could correct it that way.

Chuck

[rockyroad]

B gets the ball for a throw-in from anywhere along the baseline...even using the POI rationale, since A made both of the free throws, B is entitled to the throw-in, so give it back to them...and be ready to turn a few games back in...it is not a correctible error situation, just a screw-up...

[mick]

Originally posted by ChuckElias

I don't see how you could make that case, mick. The officials realized the error immediately following the technical free throws. So they were merited and they were awarded. If you catch it before shooting the technical FTs then maybe you could correct it that way.

Chuck

Chuck,
Yes, they realized, but did not award.

The officials failed to award.
(A1 shoots)
Then, they award.
Then POI.

Fun, huh?

mick

[rockyroad]

I disagree Mick...this situation was discussed at length at our annual meeting, and the ruling our supervisor gave - which came from Weston and Jacobs - was that it was not correctable, since all merited free throws had been shot, and since A1 had made both of the bonus shots, B is entitled to a throw-in from anywhere along the baseline...had A1 missed the first or made the first and missed the second, then we would use the AP arrow since we had a situation where we did not have anyone in control of the ball...I looked through the book, but it's not in there, and this is the "official" ruling from "on high"...

[mick]

Originally posted by rockyroad
I disagree Mick...this situation was discussed at length at our annual meeting, and the ruling our supervisor gave - which came from Weston and Jacobs - was that it was not correctable, since all merited free throws had been shot, and since A1 had made both of the bonus shots, B is entitled to a throw-in from anywhere along the baseline...had A1 missed the first or made the first and missed the second, then we would use the AP arrow since we had a situation where we did not have anyone in control of the ball...I looked through the book, but it's not in there, and this is the "official" ruling from "on high"...

dj,
Let's try this then, completely another tack.

The fouls were False Multiple Foul - two or more fouls by the same team but by only one player on that team.

8-7-1 Ball in play after False Multiple Foul - After the last free throw after a false multiple foul, the ball shall be put in play as if the penalty for the last foul of the false multiple foul were the only one administered.

Thus, if the last foul was the "curse", then why is not the ball still given at POI, ie. Team B on the endline.

Isn't it true that, from the original case, the ball must go to Team B on the endline regardless of how we rationalize it?

mick

[rockyroad]

Originally posted by mick
[Isn't it true that, from the original case, the ball must go to Team B on the endline regardless of how we rationalize it?

mick

[/B]

Yes...that is true...it's just that rationalizing part that always gets me all confused!