The Official Forum

The Official Forum (https://forum.officiating.com/)
-   Basketball (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/)
-   -   Things I hate (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/60479-things-i-hate.html)

cmhjordan23 Thu Jan 13, 2011 04:21pm

Things I hate
 
Officials that blow their whistle on my OOB call. Happens numerous times. Usually when I am the lead. Ball bounces in bounds near end line, going out but has not hit anything yet. Trail blows whistle. Why? Same when I am lead on right side of court, errant pass goes OOB sideline. I am clearly in position to make the call. Trail blows whistle prematurely. Why do some officials do this? I do not have a regular partner, do I say something to him and hope they don't do it again. It's not like it has an affect on the game.

Freddy Thu Jan 13, 2011 04:25pm

Before...or After?
 
Rather than having to say something after the fact, how 'bout if you include "which OB lines we each cover" in your pregame--the visual aid of a court diagram will all the more seal the concept.
And while you're at it, be sure to cover which partner signals the three point attempt where outside the arc. That way the "having two guys signalling a three attempt" will more readily be avoided.

JRutledge Thu Jan 13, 2011 04:27pm

You will have to ask those officials who you deal with why they do it. No one here is going to really know for sure unless they are doing it. And since I know of no one that does this other than having a complete brain fart or the ball is in the corner, my guess is no better than your guess.

Peace

Adam Thu Jan 13, 2011 05:13pm

I had one game last season where I couldn't keep from doing this. The only explanation I have is that I wasn't mentally ready for that game due to showing up late because of traffic. I walked into the gym with 55 seconds left in the previous game.

What level games is this happening to you on a regular basis, because I agree with Rut; it's not typical at the high school level around here.

cmhjordan23 Thu Jan 13, 2011 05:52pm

It usually happens during middle school games. These are officials that do high school also. It only happens when it is clearly OOB and they think it the whistle should be blown but has not become dead yet.

JRutledge Thu Jan 13, 2011 06:02pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmhjordan23 (Post 715543)
It usually happens during middle school games. These are officials that do high school also. It only happens when it is clearly OOB and they think it the whistle should be blown but has not become dead yet.

That explains a lot. Despite what people say about middle school, these games are often warm body games. Anyone that is willing to do them will and often can and you get what you get. I am sure that is not drastically different where you live as I am sure games at other levels are held on different nights and either the most experienced guys do not want to work that game or they are not very experienced. Just have a good pregame and talk about these things and hope it does not happen again. But if it does it is not the end of the world.

Peace

BillyMac Thu Jan 13, 2011 06:37pm

Out Of Bounds Responsibilities ???
 
Over the past few years, our local board, and I believe, our state board, has switched from NFHS mechanics, to IAABO mechanics, without much fanfare. Rookie officials have only had instruction in IAABO mechanics. Veteran officials are only familiar with the old NFHS mechanics where the lead has the nearest sideline all the way back to the backcourt endline. As a result of this generational gap, and the confusion regarding out of bounds responsibilities, the following was announced at our last meeting, hoping to get everyone on the same page. Keep in mind that Connecticut is the "Land of Two Person Games".

When Trail is not across the basketline: Lead had frontcourt endline, and nearer sideline back to the division line.
Trail has nearer sideline, division line, and all three backcourt boundaries.

When Trail is across the basketline: Lead had frontcourt endline, and nearer sideline to the free throw line extended.
Trail has nearer sideline, farther sideline above free throw line extended, division line, and all three backcourt
boundaries.

During transition, press, and press break, situations, the Lead, hanging back to help, will have out of bounds
responsibilities on the entire nearer sideline.

How are other boards, or associations, handling these out of bounds responsibilities?

Adam Thu Jan 13, 2011 06:41pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmhjordan23 (Post 715543)
It usually happens during middle school games. These are officials that do high school also. It only happens when it is clearly OOB and they think it the whistle should be blown but has not become dead yet.

Well, if it's clearly OOB, it should be blown because the ball is dead. I'm not sure what you mean by that.

bbcof83 Thu Jan 13, 2011 06:43pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by cmhjordan23 (Post 715543)
It usually happens during middle school games. These are officials that do high school also. It only happens when it is clearly OOB and they think it the whistle should be blown but has not become dead yet.

Sounds like they think you missed it. Are you EXTREMELY late on your OB whistle? The only time I might do this is if I absolutely have no trust in my partner in a lower level game. Even then, to blow as the T on an endline call is unheard of.

Adam Thu Jan 13, 2011 06:47pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by bbcof83 (Post 715565)
Sounds like they think you missed it. Are you EXTREMELY late on your OB whistle? The only time I might do this is if I absolutely have no trust in my partner in a lower level game. Even then, to blow as the T on an endline call is unheard of.

If he's caught up with some post action and it goes OOB in the other corner, I might (as C or 2-man T) have a very late whistle on this. But it will have bounced a couple of times in the bleachers before I do it. Very rare? Yes. Unheard of? Not really.

Camron Rust Thu Jan 13, 2011 06:50pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BillyMac (Post 715559)

When Trail is not across the basketline: Lead had frontcourt endline, and nearer sideline back to the division line.
Trail has nearer sideline, division line, and all three backcourt boundaries.

When Trail is across the basketline: Lead had frontcourt endline, and nearer sideline to the free throw line extended.
Trail has nearer sideline, farther sideline above free throw line extended, division line, and all three backcourt
boundaries
.

Unless the official is tracking the ball such that they go all the way across the court to/near the far sideline, there is no way they can accurately tell if a player stepped or dribbled on the line or not unless the player stepped/dribbled WAY across the line.

To accurately call any close line call, the official must be in a position to look down the line.

It may not happen often in the backcourt situation but it not uncommon for there to be frontcourt sideline plays above the FT line.

BillyMac Thu Jan 13, 2011 06:57pm

Whiskers On Dogs ???
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by cmhjordan23 (Post 715492)
Things I hate.

It's this some kind of bizarro Julie Andrews song?

Judtech Thu Jan 13, 2011 08:28pm

I hate when that little metal thing breaks on the zippers on our pants. Not the zippers themselves, but the metal piece you zip up with. You would THINK they would make them reinforced or something. I mean at least if the zipper itself breaks I can say, Gosh need to lose a few pounds, but when the metal tab thing breaks, what can you do? Ugh:mad:

26 Year Gap Thu Jan 13, 2011 08:35pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Judtech (Post 715593)
I hate when that little metal thing breaks on the zippers on our pants. Not the zippers themselves, but the metal piece you zip up with. You would THINK they would make them reinforced or something. I mean at least if the zipper itself breaks I can say, Gosh need to lose a few pounds, but when the metal tab thing breaks, what can you do? Ugh:mad:

I suppose you could carry a safety pin along with your inflating needle.

Judtech Thu Jan 13, 2011 08:40pm

Oh I do, trust me learned the difficult way years ago.

And by inflating needle you mean............:eek:

26 Year Gap Thu Jan 13, 2011 08:51pm

But you already knew that, right?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Judtech (Post 715598)
Oh I do, trust me learned the difficult way years ago.

And by inflating needle you mean............:eek:

http://www.happcontrols.com/images/40/49535900.jpg

RobbyinTN Thu Jan 13, 2011 09:09pm

I think they call that ball watching :D Sadly that is fairly common at the lower levels with rookie officials. I tell younger officials during the pre-game that if they call something in my area typically that means they aren't taking care of their area.

Robby

johnsonboys03 Thu Jan 13, 2011 10:51pm

I actually did it twice last week. I had just left my sons wrestling tournament and he was probably wrestling at the same time I was officiating. So needless to say my mind was were it shouldn't have been. I even had my hand up and counting as the lead while administering a foul shot lol.

I had to explain to my partner so he didn't think I was a total tool haha.

This even happened one day after I did my first three man game and was complimented by a lot of people. Guess that was Gods way of keeping me humbled lol.

But yeah your partner may not know better. If you are a crew and he (like a lot of ppl I work with) isn't studying he won't learn unless you let him know.

zm1283 Thu Jan 13, 2011 11:52pm

I wouldn't say I "hate" this but it does really bother me: Partners who believe that the other nine players have to be behind the division line when we are shooting foul shots for a technical or intentional foul. I have had half a dozen partners either mention this supposed rule or enforce it already this season, including one who told a first year official that "You can't let the team with the bench in the backcourt talk to their coach in front of their bench because the team on the end where we're shooting can't cross half court to talk to their coach". :confused:

TimTaylor Fri Jan 14, 2011 01:51am

1 on 1 fast break - you beat the play down court and are in great position, offensive player makes the layup in close proximity to defender, but no contact.......Tweet! - your partner calls a foul on the play from 65+ feet away.....

letemplay Fri Jan 14, 2011 09:29am

Another thing that bugs me
 
How about the guy that wants to sound a whistle while adm a throw in, after every routine OOB play? I'm hightailin it to get in position as a L, with my back turned 3/4 away from inbounds spot and I hear a whistle. Gets my attention for sure. I've also had to pitch in and work the clock a time or two (now there's something I really hate--much rather be on the court) and when this guy hits his whistle like that while I'm trying to figure out how to get the team or ind fouls totals correct on board...that freaks me.

ref2coach Fri Jan 14, 2011 10:34am

Quote:

Originally Posted by letemplay (Post 715739)
How about the guy that wants to sound a whistle while adm a throw in, after every routine OOB play? I'm hightailin it to get in position as a L, with my back turned 3/4 away from inbounds spot and I hear a whistle. Gets my attention for sure. I've also had to pitch in and work the clock a time or two (now there's something I really hate--much rather be on the court) and when this guy hits his whistle like that while I'm trying to figure out how to get the team or ind fouls totals correct on board...that freaks me.

Turn your head, run with your attention focused over your shoulder, keeping your eyes on players at all times.

Something that bugs me? Partners that run while focused on the wall behind the end line not keeping a eye on the players they are responsible for. :rolleyes:

ref2coach Fri Jan 14, 2011 10:43am

Quote:

Originally Posted by zm1283 (Post 715640)
I wouldn't say I "hate" this but it does really bother me: Partners who believe that the other nine players have to be behind the division line when we are shooting foul shots for a technical or intentional foul. I have had half a dozen partners either mention this supposed rule or enforce it already this season, including one who told a first year official that "You can't let the team with the bench in the backcourt talk to their coach in front of their bench because the team on the end where we're shooting can't cross half court to talk to their coach". :confused:

Was the part in red ever a rule? I find it odd that so many long time referees believe/perpetuate this myth.

JRutledge Fri Jan 14, 2011 11:03am

Quote:

Originally Posted by ref2coach (Post 715759)
Was the part in red ever a rule? I find it odd that so many long time referees believe/perpetuate this myth.

What makes you think this is a myth because of officials? When I tell players to not be on the lane line, they go where they go.

Peace

ref2coach Fri Jan 14, 2011 11:21am

Quote:

Originally Posted by JRutledge (Post 715764)
What makes you think this is a myth because of officials? When I tell players to not be on the lane line, they go where they go.

Peace

Because I ask fellow officials, when assigned with them the 1st time, "where are the other 9 player allowed to be when a TF is shot". ~30-35% of "long time" referees state, "behind the division line". We have ~300 members, I am assigned with the same partner on average less than twice per year. I have a lot of personal exposure to officials believing this myth. :rolleyes:

Jurassic Referee Fri Jan 14, 2011 11:31am

Quote:

Originally Posted by ref2coach (Post 715759)
Was the part in red ever a rule?

Not in the last 50 years that I'm aware of. Before the 3-point arc came in, they had to be behind the free throw line extended.

ref2coach Fri Jan 14, 2011 11:47am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee (Post 715770)
Not in the last 50 years that I'm aware of. Before the 3-point arc came in, they had to be behind the free throw line extended.

Thanks JR, I was hoping there was a logical explanation instead of ignorance.

JRutledge Fri Jan 14, 2011 12:00pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by ref2coach (Post 715768)
Because I ask fellow officials, when assigned with them the 1st time, "where are the other 9 player allowed to be when a TF is shot". ~30-35% of "long time" referees state, "behind the division line". We have ~300 members, I am assigned with the same partner on average less than twice per year. I have a lot of personal exposure to officials believing this myth. :rolleyes:

Maybe that is an area issue and you are not training your officials properly. I see players go places all the time and we tell them nothing about where to stand. Actually I pay very little attention to where players stand other than to not be on the lane. I have seen players go talk to their coach by their bench and they are not behind or even near the division line. And I have a lot of personal exposure to people of all levels of experience and it is usually the very new guys that make this a requirement as they have not been around long enough. I do not know about you, but we have trainings and camps and other things our associations do. If that is a myth that officials in your area are adhering to, that sounds like a training problem in your area.

Peace

BillyMac Fri Jan 14, 2011 06:28pm

And I Bet That Mark Padgett Does The Same Thing ...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by ref2coach (Post 715758)
Partners that run while focused on the wall behind the end line.

Not me. I take this opportunity to scan the crowd behind the endline for hot, single, moms.

Terrance "TJ" Fri Jan 14, 2011 10:57pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee (Post 715770)
Not in the last 50 years that I'm aware of. Before the 3-point arc came in, they had to be behind the free throw line extended.

I've been to two college games in the last three days and both had Ts. I'm guessing the one at the very beginning of the game was a book and tonight's was on our (home) coach. Both times all players were behind the division line. I esp. thought the Wed. game's crew would know the correct rule, cuz one of the Us does the local clinics before the season starts for the southern region guys.

Adam Fri Jan 14, 2011 11:08pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Terrance "TJ" (Post 716023)
I've been to two college games in the last three days and both had Ts. I'm guessing the one at the very beginning of the game was a book and tonight's was on our (home) coach. Both times all players were behind the division line. I esp. thought the Wed. game's crew would know the correct rule, cuz one of the Us does the local clinics before the season starts for the southern region guys.

Rut is right, a lot of times the players just go there. Half the time in my games they do that, and I'm positive I never told them to do it.

26 Year Gap Fri Jan 14, 2011 11:15pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 716026)
Rut is right, a lot of times the players just go there. Half the time in my games they do that, and I'm positive I never told them to do it.

Same here. All I ever say is "Clear the lane."

Terrance "TJ" Fri Jan 14, 2011 11:27pm

Which is weird, because our coach knows that catch-22 type rule about the injured shooter (opposing team) and that he can choose the shooter, yet he doesn't know the free throw line extended. :confused:

BillyMac Sat Jan 15, 2011 07:25am

Don't Sweat The Small Stuff ...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Terrance "TJ" (Post 716023)
Both times all players were behind the division line.

Legal. Leave them alone. No time for a rules clinic.

TimTaylor Sat Jan 15, 2011 11:32am

Quote:

Originally Posted by 26 year gap (Post 716029)
same here. All i ever say is "clear the lane."

+1


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:46pm.



Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.3.0 RC1