Worst luck ever
 

Three games in a row on my schedule got cancelled/postponed.

Friday, Boys JV for $52. Cancelled. Home team lost some players due to injury, education suspension, etc.

Monday, Girls JV for $52. Cancelled. Visiting team lost some players due to injury, education suspension, etc.

Today, Girls Freshmen/JV Doubleheader for $92. Postponed. DAMN EXPECTED SNOWSTORM BETTER SHOW UP!

This is about $200 I missed out on in 5 days. I really do have the worst luck ever. And the worst part is the two JV games won't be made up because the Varsity games played on, and the FR/JV doubleheader was postponed to a day I'm already officiating.

Anyone else feel like we should still be compensated at least half of the referee fee for games cancelled due to reasons other than weather or other major problems like electricity went out, flooding in school because of a plumbing problem, etc.? This really pisses me off that I missed out on $200 in 5 days.

So, if you cancel your doctor's appointment a day or so ahead of time because you feel better, should you be forced to pay the doctor half an appointment fee?

$52 for a JV game! I need to move!

Doctor can get another patient in during that time. Don't you ever get a phone call from your doctor or hair-stylist that goes something like this: "Hey, we just had a cancellation, and we would like to move you up to this day at this time"?

You can't fill in a time a game is cancelled. And besides, doctors get paid a ****load of money, they can afford to lose a few cancellations here and there. I can't afford three cancellations in 5 days!

Yes it's annoying when games get postponed/canceled after you've been assigned to them.

No, you shouldn't get a half game fee in those situations.

This stuff all evens out in the end... I'm sure you've picked up some additional games in the middle/later part of the season that you didn't have assigned initially. Where do you think those games came from?

I thought $52 was low! It's low compared to other leagues within 50 miles I think.

I haven't picked up a single game this whole season since early December. We don't get a lot of snow that when we do, people start freaking out at 3 inches of snow like it is the end of the world. Where I was to officiate today, they're expecting around 5-7 inches of snow.

Unless of course, you are open on the date the game is rescheduled & the site changes to the Pepsi Center :D

Just to clarify, because I think some are getting confused.

I am not saying we should get compensated in ALL cancellation situations. Only when a school decides to cancel because of the students getting into trouble and put on suspension, players getting injured, etc. and the team just doesn't have enough players to play a game, then we should be compensated.

Weather, Property related cancellations, then no compensation because those would be postponed to another date. But cancellations are never made up and the school would gain that money.

I just emailed both of my assignors to ask them to keep me in mind for future games that become available and fit my schedule. Hopefully I'll get a game or two later.

Well, the ones you lost that are getting rescheduled are getting picked up by someone, just not you. Perhaps you should pay the school for not being able to do those on the new dates. Now they have to search for new officials for those dates.

Man that's more than I get for Varsity! ($40)

Bottom line, officials are independent contractors. We get paid when we we're needed. No need, no pay.

If you show up at a game, and it's postponed or cancelled, then they owe you something for your time. However, if the order gets cancelled, no-one owes you anything.

You know, there's a contract somewhere that spells out when you get paid or don't get paid. Either you hold that contract (like I do here in WI) or your assignor does.

The only times I ever get paid for a game not worked is during baseball season when the home team fails to cancel and we drive to the field and it's unplayable (or a storm hits before the game starts).

Maybe if you didn't do it for the money you wouldn't get so upset...I'm just saying:confused:

Let It Snow, Let It Snow, Let It Snow ...
 

I hate it when this happens (actually, when it doesn't happen).

Medical School Costs A ****load Of Money ...
 

Hey! My daughter's in medical school. Four years, at $50,000.00 per year, all paid for with student loans. By the time she ready to practice after her residency, (80 hour workweeks) she deserves a ****load of money.

Nice. When is that one?

No, I don't wish we would get paid, because that pay would come with some strings.

Monday 2/7 3pm

You really are a rookie, aren't you?

It has nothing to do with luck. We all have games that are cancelled.

You make up for it when you get a call for a fill-in.

No, absolutely not.

If you leave home on your way to a game and they cancel, yes, you should receive half fee.

If you arrive at the school and they have to cancel after you arrive, you should receive half game fee.

If you arrive at the school and find they cancelled but didn't call you, you should be paid the full fee.

If you start the game and it has to be cancelled, you should be paid the full fee.

But if they cancel and inform you properly, you're entitled to zero compensation.

Dude, it's their money.

Besides that, they lose money too. Gate and concessions.

You really need to let it go. It's gonna happen, to all of us.

This is a full game fee in my world. If this was a half fee, baseball teams would let the umpires show up and then cancel, shrug, and pay us $30.

we get $45 thanks to a $5 increase this year.

The items I listed are NCHSAA policy.

If we show up for a football game, take the fieldm and then a breaker blows on the electrical panel that controls the stadium lights, we get half fee. If we've kicked off, we get full fee.

Why would they do this? Why would they schedule you, just to let you show up, not play and pay you $30?

ADs who don't want to make a decision. Even now, when we get a full fee, we've arrived knowing conditions aren't going to let us play.

If you think losing $200 is the worst luck ever, you've led a pretty sheltered and painfree life. (Maybe becasue your you're very, very young)

I wish the worst loss I had over something was just $200.

Ahem....
 

Here in NVA/DC (home to exceptional weathermen) we're getting very chilly RAIN. All schools closed and night activities cancelled.

I lost two (FB/JVB). :(

Well, that's just stupid. If I know we aren't going to play, I'm sure gonna call and cancel so I don't have to pay you.

$200 is a lot to me right now. I just turned 26 last week, I can't get a damn job because of this economy the way it is, and I got a bunch of credit card bills and student loans to pay. I'm not saying I'm in this job just for the money, but it does help to make money when you do a service. I need this money.

The nature of the "job" is while you make decent money for your time, there is inherent risk that you'll have this happen.

Personally, I do think that you should get compensated SOMETHING for the lost revenue opportunity. As an independent contractor, you COULD have found a revenue opportunity SOMEWHERE ELSE with reasonable lead time. ESPECIALLY since the game was canceled for non-weather-related reasons very late in the going.

At the same time, a contract is created between you, the independent contractor, and the school. In some cases, there very well may be language that includes getting paid/partially paid under certain circumstances. We typically get paid for a soccer game (even if the game gets canceled before kickoff, if we showed up for the game) in some leagues. BUT, it is dependent upon the agreement that the league/school has in these cases.

Exactly.

Scuba_ref,
ONE of the reasons VIRTUALLY ALL of us officiate is the money. If you argue with this point, my question is, "Do you always RETURN your game fee after the game is over?" If the answer is, "No." Then ONE of the reasons you officiate is to put some money in your pocket.

No, we don't, but perhaps, we should. This is ONE reason why healthcare costs are as high as they are -- no-shows and no-pays....

amen!!!!

Maybe you should be more concerned about the game and about the players rather than your pocket. It sounds as if you do it for the money.

In fairness, Juggling, I think that a very high percentage of those under 30 rate the pay as a top consideration for officiating. I can tell you my two sons -- 15 and 16 -- place pay at the TOP of the list as far as reasons to referee. Are there other reasons? Yes, there are. For the younger ones, the money is very important. It is easy for many of us making good incomes from our "day jobs" to look down on those in less fortunate situations.

Experience may cause Representing to view this situation differently five years from now. For now, this is a big deal, perhaps, for him.

A young guy blowing off some steam about something that could have gone better. We have all encountered coaches in the same position. The best we can do is attempt to understand their position, articulate as best we can the way things are, help them understand why things are the way they are, and hope that information can be applied moving forward.

+1 Well said.

You assume that officiating is the same in every state and it isn't.

Here, booking agents are assigned by the state association to book games for specific schools. There is no contract, between the booking agent and the school, the school and the official, or the official and the booking agent. The state association sets the guidelines and everyone follows them. Other states work in a similiar fashion.

Just found this in the PIAA's By-Laws:

"If a PIAA member school violates or cancels a contract with
an official, the District Committee or the Board of Directors,
within their respective jurisdictions, may require a school so
violating or so canceling to pay to the offended official the fee or
fees for the Contest or Contests which have been provided in the
official contract. Failure of a PIAA member school to live up to
the terms of the contract shall be considered a violation of the
Constitution and By-Laws of PIAA."

So, if I really wanted to be a dick I could file a complaint with the district or PIAA to get paid the $52 from both home teams because the school cancelled a contractual agreement due to non-weather conditions. Now, nothing in the by-laws says weather, but I'm assuming by "cancellations" they mean any games not made up later in the season.

Check with your respective jurisdiction. Further, just because you can doesn't mean you should. It may cost you more than $200 in the long run.

True. I emailed PIAA about it, going to wait for their response within the next day or two.

I really wouldn't push this, my guess is the rule doesn't mean what you hope it means. I'm guessing it's been worked out at the local level through your assigners.

I had two games Monday night canceled and two games last night canceled - both due to weather and both paying more than you are complaining about. If the snow doesn't melt I will lose two more tomorrow night. It happens. I don't like it because I enjoy calling ball but it isn't like I can do anything about it so I let it go.

Robby

If you think losing these games is crappy wait until you start doing stuff like this and you will probably find that you will lose more games in the future, i.e you won't be assigned.

I hope you aren't this angry when you are calling a game :eek:

OK, I'm going to try this one more time. JUST FOR CLARIFICATION...

I am NOT complaining about the game I lost due to the weather. I am complaining about the two games I lost due to one team of both games canceling out due to not enough players (injuries, educational suspensions, etc). Schools should be held accountable for non-weather situations causing a cancellation in games. That is all I am saying.

I can dig that. I was once "under 30".

Though I do hope that he also missed the opportunity to work in a great avocation.

Reminds me of something my father said about my chosen line of work (teaching): he said I had taken a "vow of poverty." I respectfully corrected him by pointing out that I chose my work because I love it, and would keep my job even if it paid a lot more.

I would say the same about officiating: I don't do it for the money, I do it because I love it. My primary motivation doesn't require me to return the money, and doesn't make me a hypocrite for keeping it.

The fact, if it is a fact, that many younger officials value the money more than some older officials probably says more about the marginal utility of money than about the officials.

I don't do this for the money either - I just love doing it which is why I've kept with it so many years. My daughter started doing it for the money. She played in HS and loved it. When she went to college she found she could work at a fast food place or a store and make minimum wage. She asked what games paid and I told her. She asked me to help her get "into" it and I did. She still works the lower level but has done a few JV games. She does a lot of the weekend tournment games. She likes doing it but will also admit a large part of her motivation is that she can make as much in an hour than she would in 5-6 hours somewhere else and has more time to study. It's how she is paying for books etc.

So you bypassed your local chapter and district rep? You might want to fill them in on your grievance before Dr. Lombardi gives them a call asking for details.

Why?

Again, the *contract* or *agreement* in place defines what your rights are. Sometimes it's not wise to try to assert those rights.

Those schools *want* to play. They have kids that won't play now, concessions that won't be sold, etc. etc. If they don't have enough players, they don't have enough players. If they have a track record of cancelling late, then don't accept games from them.

Last season, one of my regular schools in football asked me to take a lot of subvarsity dates. The previous season we lost 4 or 5 games (usually JV) when teams decided they had too many injuries and didn't want to play the games -- these were always the visiting teams playing this school. I consider it their right to cancel those games, but like I told the AD, I consider it my right to schedule games that I actually think will go on as scheduled. I took some from him, passed on others (because the visiting schools were repeat offenders). The one thing I hadn't thought about that he communicated to me was *his* frustration in schools cancelling like this.

And we're saying you're wrong. I've lost games due to non-weather cancellations. It happens all the time around here when a school loses players for various issues (sickness, suspension, transfers, disinterest). Your proposal would mean schools with borderline numbers would simply decide to cancel their seasons before they started, just in case they lost a few players along the way. Why risk having to pay officials for games that might get cancelled if you lose two players off your team?

Put my empty wallet where my mouth is!
 

CMH - Dealing in absolutes one way or the other won't win you many arguments. Of course I don't return EVERY game fee. I do however donate a lot of referee time on court whenever the opportunity presents itself; working the Lion's club scholarship game, giving back the game fee for cancer awareness nights, refereeing church basketball every Saturday for two months. The point is that most of us ref because we love it not because we get paid to do it. When getting paid to do it becomes the major justification then maybe it is time to re-evaluate.

<o></o>This is partially true also for young officials - I understand that there is a motivation continuum with money at one end and enjoyment at the other. Younger officials may tend to fall towards the money end, but if they get no enjoyment out of it then they are most likely providing a disservice to the teams they officiate.<o></o>

When I first started officiating I called a lot of games for free or next to nothing in fees. Why? Well first I loved doing it and secondly I figured it was a way to learn in an environment that was alittle less hectic than varsity ball. I think it made me a better official in the end because I was more focused on calling ball than I was on what level game it was or how much I made.

I don't call ball for the dollars. Yes I like being paid; however, I don't think about the fees first and foremost - it is secondary in my desire to officiate. I officiate as a hobby and it is a hobby that also happens to pay me a little but every Saturday for all of January and February I am calling Upward Basketball games (3-5 a Saturday) for free because I love working with the kids and they can get an experienced official for nothing. Also, I am able to train some other guys/gals to officiate and hopefully they will continue on with officiating as well. I also call some kid's (ages 5-12) rec ball that pays a big $20 a game. It gives me another opportunity to work with the kids and help them learn the sport.

The OP sounds like his primary motivation is $$. If he doesn't like having games cancelled, I am sure McDonalds is hiring and he won't have to worry about having an work night cancelled because a team decided not to play :p

Personally, I don't think it's our place to tell anyone what the right motivation for officiating is.

Around here, JV and other lower level games in rural districts are wholly filled by guys who are most into the fact that they get $40 and are 5 minutes from home. And those guys are needed.

[QUOTE=Scuba_ref;714914][COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]CMH - Dealing in absolutes one way or the other won't win you many arguments. Of course I don't return EVERY game fee. I do however donate a lot of referee time on court whenever the opportunity presents itself; working the Lion's club scholarship game, giving back the game fee for cancer awareness nights, refereeing church basketball every Saturday for two months. The point is that most of us ref because we love it not because we get paid to do it. When getting paid to do it becomes the major justification then maybe it is time to re-evaluate.

+1

I'm with Rich, we have no business telling others why they should be officiating. I started for the cash in college, and because it was fun. The standard saying is pretty true: "I don't do this for the money, but I wouldn't do it for free, either."

Have Whistle, Will Travel ...
 

When I started officiating thirty years ago, I had a young family. We were saving for three college educations, making car payments, and saving for an upgrade from our five room ranch. I would officiate games anywhere, anytime, at any level. If they played games in a bathtub, I would be there to make the toss.

Mr. Ed,
Have you been beaten enough, yet?

Snaqs statement pretty much sums up how most of us feel. At the same time, for the officials under 30 (and, perhaps, for some others out of a job or under employed at the moment), money is a MAJOR factor. Let us not judge others' situations until we have walked in their boots for a mile. And, just because we walked in those boots 20 years ago doesn't mean we have necessarily earned the right to judge TODAY, either....

I won't judge -- I worked games all through college and grad school and my primary motivator was to make money so I could go out or buy beer on the weekends. These days, my day job lets me treat officiating as a zero-sum game. Why else would I drive 180 miles round trip to work a single HS game last night? It got me out of the house, got me some exercise, and I enjoy it (most of the time). The $90 I got certainly doesn't compensate me fully for the time, mileage, and my services, but I'm OK with that.

Making a big deal out of not getting paid for canceled games, though, can cost more money in the long run. If I was an assignor, I'd start using a person like this less if I think he's going to call the state and cause trouble for something that should be handled locally.

Try showing up for a game and not getting paid at all. I was scheduled to do a soccer game. My crew showed up and visiting team wasn't there. Confusion about start time. Coach didn't give us our checks. Needless to say we contacted AD and got paid. Had another game, I think it was JV soccer again. Showed up on a Saturday morning, contract in hand. No game to officiate. Visiting team couldn't field a JV 2 team. School never told me. Contacted the AD several times. This was 1 year ago. Have yet to see that check. Oh well, only $40.

That one I'd chase down.

Don't worry. I'm sure that once the school hears about your complaint, you won't ever have to worry about them cancelling a game on you again.

I am not trying to tell the OP what his/her motivation should be for officiating - I just don't think that you should be all upset because a game got canceled in advance of your arrival. Had he arrived and no game I think he should be paid but to get a cancelation prior to game day isn't, IMHO, something to get all worked up over.