when to let it go?

Raymond · #1 (**permalink**) Sat Nov 27, 2010, 01:12pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by deecee

The best way to handle this is to just zip it. when you get home send them an email and cite the rule and case book play. if they want to argue the loosing battle wrong then they aren't just wrong but also competley stupid.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

I would advise against this, personally. ....

I'm with deecee on this one. If you can't send a simple email with a rules citatation to your colleagues without fear of some sort blowback or retribution then there is seriously something wrong.

Adam · #2 (**permalink**) Sat Nov 27, 2010, 01:19pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

I'm with deecee on this one. If you can't send a simple email with a rules citatation to your colleagues without fear of some sort blowback or retribution then there is seriously something wrong.

I guess my assumption is that something is already seriously wrong with veteran officials getting this basic play wrong. I will back off and say, depending on how exactly the conversation went and how open you think the veterans are to correction, you could use deecee's response.

Raymond · #3 (**permalink**) Sat Nov 27, 2010, 01:26pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

I guess my assumption is that something is already seriously wrong with veteran officials getting this basic play wrong. I will back off and say, depending on how exactly the conversation went and how open you think the veterans are to correction, you could use deecee's response.

I guess my caveat is that I only have these types of discussions in the first place with people who I can trust to have open/candid conversations. I don't even get involved in officiating conversations with people whom I'm not cool with. (except on the internet

)

Adam · #4 (**permalink**) Sat Nov 27, 2010, 01:46pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

I guess my caveat is that I only have these types of discussions in the first place with people who I can trust to have open/candid conversations. I don't even get involved in officiating conversations with people whom I'm not cool with. (except on the internet

)

My experience is a bit clouded, as I've had a similar (traveling, but a different aspect) discussion with three veteran officials during a game (halftime). In that situation, following up with an email would have looked petty; but we had a rulebook with us and it still didn't do any good.

johnsonboys03 · #5 (**permalink**) Sat Nov 27, 2010, 05:42pm

that is one of the problems I'm having. There is only a select few of the guys that I work with that I even want to take advice from. I'm not trying to come across as a know it all or unteachable but I don't want to take advise from someone that doesn't have what I want. I learned that a few years ago. Don't take financial advise from someone who is broke...or take advise on how to landscape from a plumber...only take it from someone who has what you want. I'm sure I'm not alone on this but I think I'm ticking some guys off in our chapter. Thing is I don't want to be a ten year vet and still doing Jv jr high games...I want varsity games soon and then college games!

deecee · #6 (**permalink**) Sat Nov 27, 2010, 05:56pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnsonboys03

that is one of the problems I'm having. There is only a select few of the guys that I work with that I even want to take advice from. I'm not trying to come across as a know it all or unteachable but I don't want to take advise from someone that doesn't have what I want. I learned that a few years ago. Don't take financial advise from someone who is broke...or take advise on how to landscape from a plumber...only take it from someone who has what you want. I'm sure I'm not alone on this but I think I'm ticking some guys off in our chapter. Thing is I don't want to be a ten year vet and still doing Jv jr high games...I want varsity games soon and then college games!

Don't take this the wrong way but you are taking a very narrow vantage point to an avocation that is more complicated than just knowing the rules and being a good official. Thousands of people can blow a whistle and call on ball fouls. Impatience in officiating might get you where you want to be fast but the fall will be just as swift. I think its reasonable to say that if you can blow a good game and manage all aspects of it and master these skills quickly, and I think that takes about 3-5 years for a good official to mature to that point. Then its fair to say you should have earned varsity games (Im also not saying you wont do any varsity games within that time but to get a substantial amount 15-20+).

Unless you are a woman who is a good official its practically unheard of to make the college ranks within 3-5 years anyway unless you know someone. If you are a very good female official you stand a good chance to be at the college level within 5 years EASY. 2-3 years might work, but you have to bust your butt at camps, off season games and be seen and when you are seen you impress.

In the end the only real 2 bits of advice I tell any rookie is listen to as many veterans philosophies and use what you are comfortable with, and secondly it's alright to screw up.

johnsonboys03 · #7 (**permalink**) Sat Nov 27, 2010, 06:43pm

I realize that...I'm not saying I'm going to be a division one official next year or anything lol. I just don't want my goals to stop at JV games that's all I ment by that. I really appreciate all your comments, I'll use them all and I'm sure it'll help me in future situations that I'll come accross.

Adam · #8 (**permalink**) Sun Nov 28, 2010, 12:36am

What are you doing that's ticking off the veterans? Stop doing that. No one says you have to take their advice, but no one says you have to tell them you're not taking it either.

TheOracle · #9 (**permalink**) Mon Nov 29, 2010, 01:03am

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnsonboys03

I realize that...I'm not saying I'm going to be a division one official next year or anything lol. I just don't want my goals to stop at JV games that's all I ment by that. I really appreciate all your comments, I'll use them all and I'm sure it'll help me in future situations that I'll come accross.

Vehemently arguing with "peers" who have may have more power (years) than you will do you no good. Listen to the guys you want to, don't argue much with guys you don't think are very good. If you are calling it right, and they are not, they'll be in you rear view mirror soon, anyway.

Kingsman1288 · #10 (**permalink**) Sun Nov 28, 2010, 02:02am

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnsonboys03

There is only a select few of the guys that I work with that I even want to take advice from. I'm not trying to come across as a know it all or unteachable but I don't want to take advise from someone that doesn't have what I want.

With that statement you've just come across as a know it all/unteachable IMO. You can learn something from everyone you work with, whether it be how they handle a situation or better positioning, etc. Never go into a game with the mentality that you don't want to/can't learn from your partner. We're all still learning on some level.

If you feel you're getting the cold shoulder from the vets in your area take a step back and think about it. It could be the way you talk to them, especially those who you don't want to learn from. Maybe its your body language when you talk to them? Eye rolling, that kinda thing? I'm not saying that's the reason why, but it could be. Ask someone who you trust to give an honest opinion of you as an official and partner, you might be surprised at what you hear.

BTW, college ball in two years doesn't usually happen unless you're from SoCal. It's straight to D1 in that case