Uniform/jewelry police - the pain

[grunewar]

What a can of worms.......

[Judtech]

Originally Posted by grunewar

What a can of worms.......

Oh, I have got your can of worms right here:

"Before every meet, I'm conscious of taking off my earrings and necklaces," she said. "But, I just never really thought about the wristband. I've been wearing it nonstop since November."

So with this admission, does she and the school have to forfeit every match she participated in since November? I mean, rules are rules right?
To me the bottom line is what coach Knowles did was laying in wait to ambush the young lady. Not very cricket IMO.
Since I don't know much about Track and Field rules, are there not judges that would notice this and make the coach or player aware?
If I REALLY wanted to try and give this legs as an administrator, I would ask if the Monrovia coach could actually PROVE she wore the bracelet during her jump. Coach Knowles stated that he didn't see it until AFTER the successful completion of the jump. Now if the athlete aborted one attempt before she completed her successful attempt, there was ample opportunity for this aggrieved coach to notice the bracelet. Since he didnt mention anything until AFTER the successful vault, his assertion that the bracelet was worn DURING the jump would be suspect. Unless of course he is lying about not "laying in wait to ambush" the jumper.
From the article, I don't think very much of this Coach Knowles cat.

[Amesman]

Originally Posted by Judtech

Oh, I have got your can of worms right here:

"Before every meet, I'm conscious of taking off my earrings and necklaces," she said. "But, I just never really thought about the wristband. I've been wearing it nonstop since November."

So with this admission, does she and the school have to forfeit every match she participated in since November? I mean, rules are rules right?
To me the bottom line is what coach Knowles did was laying in wait to ambush the young lady. Not very cricket IMO.
Since I don't know much about Track and Field rules, are there not judges that would notice this and make the coach or player aware?
If I REALLY wanted to try and give this legs as an administrator, I would ask if the Monrovia coach could actually PROVE she wore the bracelet during her jump. Coach Knowles stated that he didn't see it until AFTER the successful completion of the jump. Now if the athlete aborted one attempt before she completed her successful attempt, there was ample opportunity for this aggrieved coach to notice the bracelet. Since he didnt mention anything until AFTER the successful vault, his assertion that the bracelet was worn DURING the jump would be suspect. Unless of course he is lying about not "laying in wait to ambush" the jumper.
From the article, I don't think very much of this Coach Knowles cat.

Well put.

That's one reason why, if the jewelry isn't deemed performance-enhancing material, the athlete should get the pass on it if it's missed beforehand, like it's done for hoops. But I, too, don't know much about track officiating so not sure of all their rationale, or if there could be someone available to say, "Uh, you're not jumping until you take that bracelet off."

[bainsey]

I think a lot of people are viewing this rather myopically. Miss Laird's jewelry did not cost her team any championship, and it's a shame she things that way. Instead, it cost her team some points.

This was not a one-event contest. Monrovia won this meet in the same fashion that other teams win theirs -- because they outscored their competition, and all of the points add up. You can feel bad for Miss Laird (I sure do), but don't forget there was a bunch of Monrovia girls who also played a role in the reason there's a trophy at that school.

Had this incident happened at the beginning or middle of the meet, you can bet that this would get no press. But in reality, when a basketball game ends with a one or two point margin, those calls in the first quarter affect the outcome of the game every bit as those in the final minute. Never, ever think that one play wins or loses a game/meet/match. Every contest is a collection.

[Judtech]

Originally Posted by bainsey

I think a lot of people are viewing this rather myopically. Miss Laird's jewelry did not cost her team any championship, and it's a shame she things that way. Instead, it cost her team some points.

This was not a one-event contest. Monrovia won this meet in the same fashion that other teams win theirs -- because they outscored their competition, and all of the points add up. You can feel bad for Miss Laird (I sure do), but don't forget there was a bunch of Monrovia girls who also played a role in the reason there's a trophy at that school.

Had this incident happened at the beginning or middle of the meet, you can bet that this would get no press. But in reality, when a basketball game ends with a one or two point margin, those calls in the first quarter affect the outcome of the game every bit as those in the final minute. Never, ever think that one play wins or loses a game/meet/match. Every contest is a collection.

It could be argued that Monrovia did not in fact outscore the competition, since the score was originally posted and gave the victory to the other squad. It was when the points were subtracted AFTER the event was over that there was a score change.
It is a crappy rule that needs to be addressed. IMO, the other person who needs blame is the official supervising the pole vault contest. I wonder if this supervisor was in the same capacity at the other events this student participated in while wearing the SAME friendship bracelet

[bainsey]

Originally Posted by Judtech

It could be argued that Monrovia did not in fact outscore the competition, since the score was originally posted and gave the victory to the other squad. It was when the points were subtracted AFTER the event was over that there was a score change.

Miss Laird's points are like those of a high school forward who nails a shot while charging into his defender -- they never existed.

I'm not crazy about this rule, either, but it's not like no-one knew about it all season.

[Altor]

I am a track and field official. And let me tell you, being the uniform and jewelry police is the worst part of the job, especially if you don't catch it before the event starts.

We all know, FED rules on jewelry are pretty much the same across all sports...Don't wear it. The trouble is, there isn't a good penalty in track to cover such a minor infraction. In football, you might mark off penalty yards. In basketball, a technical foul might be in order. (I don't know...the rulebook may allow for a warning and instruction to take it off in those sports first.) In track, there really is no penalty other than disqualification from the event. It's crappy, but that is the rule. That's why our association makes it a point to remind all athletes before an event begins to take off all jewelry. As somebody said on another board (baseball?) a couple days ago, "If you weren't born with it, it's jewelry."

And no, you don't disqualify her or have her team forfeit previous meets because of her admission, just like you wouldn't go back and award missed free throws days after a basketball game is completed. Protests for misapplication of the rules must be filed within 30 minutes of completion of the event.

[gslefeb]

VPA alters track attire rules | The Burlington Free Press | Burlington, Vermont

[Jurassic Referee]

Whatinthehell has all of this got to do with us?

We don't make the rules. We don't decide the penalties. We just do what we're we're paid to do. And we're paid not to ignore plainly written rules.

If it's a crappy rule, pin the blame on the clowns who made the rule. It's got absolutely NOTHING to do with the officiating of the individual sport. It's got EVERYTHING to do with the the rulesmakers of that particular sport.

The real uniform police are the goobers who installed this rule. Just wanted to make that clear.

[DLH17]

Originally Posted by jurassic referee

whatinthehell has all of this got to do with us?

We don't make the rules. We don't decide the penalties. We just do what we're we're paid to do. And we're paid not to ignore plainly written rules.

If it's a crappy rule, pin the blame on the clowns who made the rule. It's got absolutely nothing to do with the officiating of the individual sport. It's got everything to do with the the rulesmakers of that particular sport.

The real uniform police are the goobers who installed this rule. Just wanted to make that clear.

+1

[Mark Padgett]

Originally Posted by gslefeb

VPA alters track attire rules | The Burlington Free Press | Burlington, Vermont

From the story:

"In 1992, North Country’s Andy Oliver set a state record in the boys javelin but his throw of 199 feet, 3 inches was erased when he was disqualified for being out of uniform after a coach brought the infraction to the officials’ attention."

So this kid participated nude?!?!?! It's a good thing he wasn't on their javelin catching team!

[Judtech]

and by 'javelin' you mean.......

[APG]

Originally Posted by Altor

In basketball, a technical foul might be in order. (I don't know...the rulebook may allow for a warning and instruction to take it off in those sports first.)

There's no provision that I'm aware of for giving a technical foul for a uniform/jewelry violation. Only thing we can tell them to do is take it off or have the player substituted for, and in my opinion is the correct way to handle a situation like that. From the sound of it, the track and field rule is silly.

[Altor]

Originally Posted by AllPurposeGamer

There's no provision that I'm aware of for giving a technical foul for a uniform/jewelry violation. Only thing we can tell them to do is take it off or have the player substituted for, and in my opinion is the correct way to handle a situation like that. From the sound of it, the track and field rule is silly.

Like I said...I didn't know what was in those rulebooks.

And it is a harsh punishment, I agree. But you can't really stop a race and ask the coach to substitute for the competitor. If you have an idea that I can submit to the rules advisory committee in my state, I'm all ears.

We try to do the preventive officiating that we feel these rules require. I've told competitors standing on a runway waiting for an attempt to take off the necklace. Heck, I've stopped a competitor on his pole vault approach because he still had a warm-up jersey on which was not allowed.

I've also missed the uniform and jewelry violations until it was too late to do the preventive officiating. I hate that. But, in the end, it is the duty of the coach and competitor to know the rule and abide by it.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by AllPurposeGamer

There's no provision that I'm aware of for giving a technical foul for a uniform/jewelry violation. Only thing we can tell them to do is take it off or have the player substituted for, and in my opinion is the correct way to handle a situation like that.

Nope, under NFHS rules we can't tell a player to take anything off. We can only tell them that they can't participate if they wear jewelry. The decision to take the jewelry off or not lies solely with the person wearing it.