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bas2456 Mon Mar 22, 2010 12:42pm

Crazy rule set
 
My last games of the season last night were two high school rec games.

The organization that puts the league on is the same one in which I've been doing middle school rec games. I don't understand why the rules are so different.

The middle school leagues use standard NFHS rules, with a couple of modifications (ie press rules).

The high school league, however, uses some wildly different modifications.

Two halves of 25 minutes, running clock. The clock never stops, not even in the last minute (foreshadowing).

No free throws shot. Ever. Should a player get fouled in the act of shooting and miss the shot, his team shall be awarded one point and they will retain possession. Should they make the shot, his team will be awarded three points, and the other team will get possession.

The official doesn't handle the ball prior to an inbounds pass. This becomes especially problematic when reporting a foul, as the players just get it and go.

The biggest problem I ran into last night was in the last minute of a close game. I called a held ball with about fifteen seconds left. There was no possession arrow so we had to go ask the table, which was located about 20 feet off one of the endlines. The clock is still running because of the rules. We had them stop the clock with four seconds left As I'm coming back with blue possession, I see a blue player push a purple player. So I T him up, which gives purple two automatic points and possession. They missed the three to tie it.

Not the way I would make up the rules, but that's just me.

Da Official Mon Mar 22, 2010 01:06pm

Fun times.........Good luck with that!

Mark Padgett Mon Mar 22, 2010 01:47pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by bas2456 (Post 669847)
Two halves of 25 minutes, running clock. The clock never stops, not even in the last minute (foreshadowing)

Are there no timeouts? Does the clock run during halftime? After the game is over, does it keep running? :confused:

jTheUmp Mon Mar 22, 2010 03:03pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by bas2456 (Post 669847)
There was no possession arrow so we had to go ask the table

Stick a spare whistle (or something of similar size and weight) in the front pants pocket, so that when you're facing the benches, the whistle is on the same side as the bench of the team with the arrow.

I picked that tip up from a veteran in my association, and it works beautifully.

Mark Padgett Mon Mar 22, 2010 03:05pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by jTheUmp (Post 669895)
Stick a spare whistle (or something of similar size and weight) in the front pants pocket, so that when you're facing the benches, the whistle is on the same side as the bench of the team with the arrow.

I picked that tip up from a veteran in my association, and it works beautifully.

Try using a Hickory Farms beefstick. It looks really cool when you move it from one side to the other. Plus - you get a lot of looks from the hot moms. :p

bob jenkins Mon Mar 22, 2010 03:18pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by jTheUmp (Post 669895)
Stick a spare whistle (or something of similar size and weight) in the front pants pocket, so that when you're facing the benches, the whistle is on the same side as the bench of the team with the arrow.

I picked that tip up from a veteran in my association, and it works beautifully.

It also makes you look like a rookie. I'd advise to just remember the arrow, and get out of the habit of switching the whistle from one pocket to the other.

I recognize that's harder to do when one is working multiple youth games on a single day.

Raymond Mon Mar 22, 2010 03:41pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by bob jenkins (Post 669906)
It also makes you look like a rookie. I'd advise to just remember the arrow, and get out of the habit of switching the whistle from one pocket to the other.

I recognize that's harder to do when one is working multiple youth games on a single day.

Well, often officials working those types of games with those crazy rules are newer officials, so they wouldn't look out of place.

bas2456 Mon Mar 22, 2010 04:12pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Padgett (Post 669870)
Are there no timeouts? Does the clock run during halftime? After the game is over, does it keep running? :confused:

Ya, I forgot that part...No timeouts are allowed. They're also allowed to sub on the fly, as in like hockey.

bas2456 Mon Mar 22, 2010 04:14pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by jTheUmp (Post 669895)
Stick a spare whistle (or something of similar size and weight) in the front pants pocket, so that when you're facing the benches, the whistle is on the same side as the bench of the team with the arrow.

I picked that tip up from a veteran in my association, and it works beautifully.

I have heard that before, but I wasn't anticipating the lack of an arrow. I did have a spare whistle with me, but didn't even think about it to tell you the truth.

shutupneff Mon Mar 22, 2010 04:29pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by jTheUmp (Post 669895)
Stick a spare whistle (or something of similar size and weight) in the front pants pocket, so that when you're facing the benches, the whistle is on the same side as the bench of the team with the arrow.

I picked that tip up from a veteran in my association, and it works beautifully.

I prefer a rubber band or hair tie around the wrist pointing to the team's bench. It's inconspicuous, less unprofessional looking when you switch it, and it allows you to check to see if your partner agrees with you without having to ask.

Adam Mon Mar 22, 2010 04:35pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by shutupneff (Post 669933)
I prefer a rubber band or hair tie around the wrist pointing to the team's bench. It's inconspicuous, less unprofessional looking when you switch it, and it allows you to check to see if your partner agrees with you without having to ask.

This is one of those weird things that's supported in some areas at even the varsity level; while other areas view it as bush-league even in rec ball. Personally, I wouldn't even consider doing it in school ball but would have no problem with someone doing it when they're working three rec games with unreliable table crew.

I would use it as an opportunity to work on my ability to remember the arrow.

Jurassic Referee Mon Mar 22, 2010 04:36pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by shutupneff (Post 669933)
I prefer a rubber band or hair tie around the wrist pointing to the team's bench. It's inconspicuous, less unprofessional looking when you switch it, and it allows you to check to see if your partner agrees with you without having to ask.

Disagree. That's just another rookie move. How can it be more professional when you're wearing something that you can't allow a player to wear, by rule?

M&M Guy Mon Mar 22, 2010 04:38pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by shutupneff (Post 669933)
I prefer a rubber band or hair tie around the wrist pointing to the team's bench. It's inconspicuous, less unprofessional looking when you switch it, and it allows you to check to see if your partner agrees with you without having to ask.

The only problem with that is players are not allowed to wear bands on the wrists, so officials should also not wear them.

As Bob mentioned, it is a good habit to get into simply remembering the direction of the arrow, rather than using some device.

Adam Mon Mar 22, 2010 04:40pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by M&M Guy (Post 669940)
The only problem with that is players are not allowed to wear bands on the wrists, so officials should also not wear them.

Players can't wear wedding rings, either; but we (as in the officials in my area) do. I think it looks unprofessional but this reasoning doesn't mean much to me.

DLH17 Mon Mar 22, 2010 04:41pm

I typically have a tube of Carmex in my pocket during games. Just so happens it makes for a great way to keep track of possession.

M&M Guy Mon Mar 22, 2010 04:53pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 669941)
Players can't wear wedding rings, either; but we (as in the officials in my area) do. I think it looks unprofessional but this reasoning doesn't mean much to me.

While that's true in my area for HS, I know it is now not allowed in NCAA-W.

Obviously, check local listings.

(However, it's still my opinion that it doesn't look professional at any level to do the pocket thing, whether it's a whistle, chapstick, or beef stick.)

Camron Rust Mon Mar 22, 2010 04:58pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by M&M Guy (Post 669940)
The only problem with that is players are not allowed to wear bands on the wrists, so officials should also not wear them.

Players can't wear striped shirts or a lanyard either, but officials do????

What players are or are not allowed to wear has nothing to do with what officials are or are not allowed to wear.

DLH17 Mon Mar 22, 2010 05:02pm

A beat down is comin' your way, CR. Look out!

Adam Mon Mar 22, 2010 05:03pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by camron rust (Post 669950)
players can't wear striped shirts or a lanyard either, but officials do????

What players are or are not allowed to wear has nothing to do with what officials are or are not allowed to wear.

+1

M&M Guy Mon Mar 22, 2010 05:15pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Camron Rust (Post 669950)
Players can't wear striped shirts or a lanyard either, but officials do????

What players are or are not allowed to wear has nothing to do with what officials are or are not allowed to wear.

I was only told that it was a safety issue, much the same as any piece of jewlery that a player might wear. Yes, I know the lanyard is obviously a direct conflict to that ideal, but it is a part of the official's uniform, so we are allowed (and in some cases required) to wear one.

I've worn my wedding ring on the HS court, and taken it off for the NCAA court. That's why I said to check local listings. Snaqs mentioned the rubber band might be a good idea for some local rec leagues, and I've seen that, along with officials wearing watches. It still doesn't look professional, but it may be allowed in some cases.

I will go back and check, but I think I did not see a single official working the tournament have any rubberband or chapstick device to help keep track of the arrow. I wonder why? ;)

Adam Mon Mar 22, 2010 05:19pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by M&M Guy (Post 669962)
I will go back and check, but I think I did not see a single official working the tournament have any rubberband or chapstick device to help keep track of the arrow. I wonder why? ;)

Because they're really discreet?

M&M Guy Mon Mar 22, 2010 05:27pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 669964)
Because they're really discreet?

Yep. That's where I learned to discreetly send you a picture of one finger...

:p :D

Jurassic Referee Mon Mar 22, 2010 05:33pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by M&M Guy (Post 669946)
(However, it's still my opinion that it doesn't look professional at any level to do the pocket thing, whether it's a whistle, chapstick, or beef stick.)

+1...as well as wearing anything on a wrist.

It's telling imo, is what it is.

Camron Rust Mon Mar 22, 2010 05:34pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by M&M Guy (Post 669962)
I was only told that it was a safety issue, much the same as any piece of jewlery that a player might wear. Yes, I know the lanyard is obviously a direct conflict to that ideal, but it is a part of the official's uniform, so we are allowed (and in some cases required) to wear one.

I've worn my wedding ring on the HS court, and taken it off for the NCAA court. That's why I said to check local listings. Snaqs mentioned the rubber band might be a good idea for some local rec leagues, and I've seen that, along with officials wearing watches. It still doesn't look professional, but it may be allowed in some cases.

I will go back and check, but I think I did not see a single official working the tournament have any rubberband or chapstick device to help keep track of the arrow. I wonder why? ;)


Safety issue? The last time I saw a player scrapping with an official for the ball, that player was on their way out the door. In all seriousness, here should really be no way for a rubber band on an official's wrist to ever be a safety issue. And unless it is a super-rubberband, it's going to break a long time before it hurts someone.

As for the lanyard, it wouldn't be hard to invent a break-away lanyard. In fact, my employer provides them for our ID badges....one tug and its off. Since the NFHS and NCAA don't require such, it can't really be that big of a risk.

As for the professionalism of it...I fully agree, it doesn't look good.

As for the tourney officials not doing it...maybe, just maybe, it is because they have someone doing the books/table that is a wee bit more experienced and reliable.

M&M Guy Mon Mar 22, 2010 05:44pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Camron Rust (Post 669973)
Safety issue? The last time I saw a player scrapping with an official for the ball, that player was on their way out the door. In all seriousness, here should really be no way for a rubber band on an official's wrist to ever be a safety issue. And unless it is a super-rubberband, it's going to break a long time before it hurts someone.

As for the lanyard, it wouldn't be hard to invent a break-away lanyard. In fact, my employer provides them for our ID badges....one tug and its off. Since the NFHS and NCAA don't require such, it can't really be that big of a risk.

As for the professionalism of it...I fully agree, it doesn't look good.

Hey, I don't disagree that the safety of an official wearing a ring or rubberband is a very remote point. I'm only going by what I've been told. :shrug and smile:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Camron Rust (Post 669973)
As for the tourney officials not doing it...maybe, just maybe, it is because they have someone doing the books/table that is a wee bit more experienced and reliable.

And, it also might be because they've learned a better way to take care of it, and that is to simply remember it, along with the other skills they've acquired to get to that level.

BillyMac Mon Mar 22, 2010 05:49pm

Only Reason Not To Throw Out All My Pea Whistles ...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by bob jenkins (Post 669906)
It also makes you look like a rookie. I'd advise to just remember the arrow, and get out of the habit of switching the whistle from one pocket to the other.

Required mechanic here in my little corner of Connecticut. I thought that it would only last a year, or two, when the alternating possesion first replaced multiple jump balls, to give table crews time to adjust to the new rule, but it's still here.

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2762/...708552c6_m.jpg

BillyMac Mon Mar 22, 2010 06:00pm

That Ain't Lassie Coming To Pull You Out Of The Well ...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Padgett (Post 669897)
Try using a Hickory Farms beefstick. You get a lot of looks from the hot moms.

You also probably get a lot of looks from service dogs.

http://thm-a04.yimg.com/nimage/adf98134ebd27e2c

bas2456 Mon Mar 22, 2010 09:32pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Camron Rust (Post 669973)

As for the lanyard, it wouldn't be hard to invent a break-away lanyard. In fact, my employer provides them for our ID badges....one tug and its off. Since the NFHS and NCAA don't require such, it can't really be that big of a risk.

Someone has already beaten you to the punch.


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