Technical before OT
 

Interesting situation last night. Black team is 2 points ahead. Called a foul with probably 1 second on clock against Black as White player was shooting. Wild shot goes in. Tie score and White shoots free throw to win game. White, during FT, while ball is in the air, steps on line. FT attempt goes in, I'm blowing whistle and waving off the score while the place goes wild as White thinks they have won the game. This, by the way, was a 7-8 grade tournament championship. While my partner and I are trying to get order restored the White coach is going balistic. Close to technical but didn't cross the line, IMO. If he had dropped the F bomb and a technical was called, would the resulting FT for black, if made, end the game in Black's favor or would the OT start with Black 1 point ahead?

You didn't say so, but I'm assuming time had expired, so you were shooting with the lane cleared. In that case, the 4th period is over as soon as A1's FT is not successful; so a T called at that point would start the OT.

I think he still has 1 second on the clock.

With the fans thinking he'd won the game, it's hard to say, but you might be right. I wouldn't think there'd be any confusion, though, on how to administer the T if there was still a second on the clock.

With 1 second on the clock the Technical would be during regulation play. After the free throws black ball at mid court with 1 second on clock?

Yes, just like any other technical that occurs with time on the clock.

If time had in fact expired, isn't this 5.6.2D(b)? You don't know if there is to be an overtime until the T shots have been administered.

Hint: What's the score when time expires in 5.6.2D(b)?

The situation indicates it could be anything from team A down 60-59, to up 61-60 after they shoot their FT's. Same thing here, score is either tied or white is ahead by 1 when white coach gets the T. The only time the free throws for the T were not shot was when the results of the personal foul free throws made the score a 3 point game. That would make shooting T free throws meaningless.

Overtime begins as soon as the 4th quarter ends with the score tied. If the score is not tied, all FTs will be shot to determine whether it should be played or not.

5.6COMMENT B

hope drh shows up to clarify.....

Still struggling with this. 5.6.2Db indicates a tying free throw is made after the 4th period has ended (A1 was fouled in act of shooting as time expires). It also indicates in that situation, if either free throw for the technical foul is successful, no extra period is required.

In this case, the 4th period is not over until the free throws are completed for the shooting foul. Therefore, any fouls committed prior to the last free throw would be part of the 4th period, not the over time. That's the key difference from the OP.

There we go. That's the distinquishment I was looking for.

Amesman likes this


(seriously)

Sorry I didn't get back sooner, been busy with games. The clock had, in fact, expired. As I read the posts and think about the situation we probably should have put 1 second back on the clock because the foul occured before the clock expired.

Be that as it may, from what I gather, if, in fact, a technical had been called on the coach AFTER time expired the resulting FT would start the OT. If the technical was called while order was being restored and I put 1 second on the clock, allowing the other team to shoot a FT and possibly win the game I would have needed an escourt out of the gym.

That being said, I saw the offended coach the next day while doing more games and he told me, though I don't think I believe him, that they had a video of the game and the FT in question and that I was 1000% right on the call and he apologized for his behavior. I thanked him and accepted his apology.

So, thank you all for your responses. You always see something or experience something in this game that makes you stop and think.

1000%? did you tell him you would be happy with 100%?:D

I was 100% sure, but I think he was feeling foolish for his behavior. His comment at the time was, "How can you do this to me?" I told him the game wasn't about him. I was about the kids. So I think he was thinking about that. At least, I hope he was.

:D
I'll add that you can only put time back on if you know how much to put up, don't just guess at 1 second.

So, if the foul occured before time ran out and the timekeeper didn't stop the clock, how much time would you put on, considering this was not the state-the-art timing equipment that counts down hundredths of seconds?

Whatever I saw when I looked up at the clock after the whistle sounded.

You don't guess. You can only restore the exact time which you observed.

If the clock doesn't show tenths and you don't see a 1 up there when you look, then you apply these:

"If a held ball or violation occurs so near the expiration of time that the clock is
not stopped before time expires, the quarter or extra period ends with the held
ball or violation."
"If a foul occurs so near the expiration of time that the timer cannot get the clock
stopped before time expires or after time expires, but while the ball is in flight
during a try or tap for field goal, the quarter or extra period ends when the free
throw(s) and all related activity have been completed."

Got it, thanks