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-   -   Jay Bilas, a Lawyer?, He can not even read. (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/57056-jay-bilas-lawyer-he-can-not-even-read.html)

Jurassic Referee Fri Feb 12, 2010 09:43am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nevadaref (Post 661101)
Billy,
I use the procedure outlined in (b). I believe that it is correct based upon the wording of the NFHS rule.

RULE 5
SECTION 8 TIME-OUT, STOPPING PLAY
Time-out occurs and the clock, if running, shall be stopped when an official:
3 . . . Grants a player’s/head coach’s oral or visual request for a time-out,
such request being granted only when:
a. The ball is in control or at the disposal of a player of his/her team.
b. The ball is dead, unless replacement of a disqualified, or injured player(s),
or a player directed to leave the game is pending, and a substitute(s) is
available and required.


According to the rule as written, it is not the timing of the request, but the timing of the granting of that request which must meet the two criteria listed.

If the NFHS desires for only the timing of the request to be subject to those constraints, then it needs to change the wording of the rule. That could be done by replacing the word "granted" with "honored."
Does that mean that if you call a player control foul but don't blow your whistle and signal the PC foul until the ball is loose, you have to change it to a team control foul?

Same logic.....

just another ref Fri Feb 12, 2010 09:47am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee (Post 661140)
Does that mean that if you call a player control foul but don't blow your whistle and signal the PC foul until the ball is loose, you have to change it to a team control foul?

Same logic.....

Same logic, yes. Same wording, no. The foul causes the ball to become dead. The timeout request does not. When the timeout is granted is not specifically defined in any book.

Is it?

Nevadaref Fri Feb 12, 2010 10:09am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee (Post 661140)
Does that mean that if you call a player control foul but don't blow your whistle and signal the PC foul until the ball is loose, you have to change it to a team control foul?

Same logic.....
Try reading 6-7, JR, as already posted in this thread. There's a rule for the PC stating that the ball is dead at the time of the foul.

If you are going to criticize, you may wish to get your rules straight.

Jurassic Referee Fri Feb 12, 2010 10:47am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nevadaref (Post 661147)
Try reading 6-7, JR, as already posted in this thread. There's a rule for the PC stating that the ball is dead at the time of the foul.

If you are going to criticize, you may wish to get your rules straight.
And rule 5-8-1 says that time-out occurs and the clock, if running, shall be stopped, when an official signals a foul, NOT at the time of the foul.

You might try looking at all the rules, not just the ones convenient to your purpose.

And yes, the rule book verbiage used isn't very good either. But I still can't believe that the intent of the rulesmakers is for us to hear a request, check to see if the request is from a coach or player, and then check again to make sure that the request is still legal before granting that TO request. That makes no sense at all. And you sureasheck would never see those quick TO requests granted when a player is laying on the court with the ball and a coach is asking for a TO trying to avoid a held ball.

bob jenkins Fri Feb 12, 2010 11:17am
I can't remember -- who was it who recently posted "same ****, different day"?

Adam Fri Feb 12, 2010 11:20am
Quote:
Originally Posted by bob jenkins (Post 661179)
I can't remember -- who was it who recently posted "same ****, different day"?
{raising his hand} Ooooh ooooh! I know! I know!

Jurassic Referee Fri Feb 12, 2010 11:26am
Quote:
Originally Posted by bob jenkins (Post 661179)
I can't remember -- who was it who recently posted "same ****, different day"?
Well it wasn't the same poster that gave another poster sh!t about his inane comments about 8 minutes after he himself made an inane comment.

He'd never do that.

Rich Fri Feb 12, 2010 11:44am
Quote:
Originally Posted by RichMSN (Post 660604)
Someone from Nevada will be along to disagree with you.... :D
Nice to see a quick hit-and-run can provoke what followed.

Raymond Fri Feb 12, 2010 11:50am
I've never had a problem with this time-out thingy.

"TIME OUT....BEFORE HE RELEASED THE PASS"

"TIME OUT....BEFORE SHOT WAS RELEASED"

"TIME OUT....BEFORE STEPPING OUT OF BOUNDS"

"TIME OUT....BEFORE HE WAS TIED UP"


Verbalizing why you are granting the time-out in these types of situations clears up a lot of confusion.

Nevadaref Fri Feb 12, 2010 06:19pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by BadNewsRef (Post 661193)
I've never had a problem with this time-out thingy.

"TIME OUT....BEFORE HE RELEASED THE PASS"

"TIME OUT....BEFORE SHOT WAS RELEASED"

"TIME OUT....BEFORE STEPPING OUT OF BOUNDS"

"TIME OUT....BEFORE HE WAS TIED UP"


Verbalizing why you are granting the time-out in these types of situations clears up a lot of confusion.
Sure, if you choose not to follow the rules. :rolleyes:

"Time-out ... three possessions ago."
"Time-out ... back in the 2nd quarter."

Yeah, just explain it. Just wonderful.

Raymond Sat Feb 13, 2010 10:27am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nevadaref (Post 661342)
Sure, if you choose not to follow the rules. :rolleyes:

"Time-out ... three possessions ago."
"Time-out ... back in the 2nd quarter."

Yeah, just explain it. Just wonderful.
I missed anywhere in this thread where someone talked about granting times-out from 3 possessions ago or from a previouis quarter. Can you please point me to that post so I can on the same Bizarro topic you are apparently on.

Guess you have a problem in Nevada with officials lacking common sense and sticking to reality. Not a problem in Virginia. Must be a regional thing.


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