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We kicked it. Did I do enough?
GV. 3rd quarter. I'm Lead. Team A has a try from the opposite side of the floor from me.
Ball hits up top (I'm eyeing rebounding action) caroms, tip, bat, scramble, bat (last bat by A1 knocks ball into back court. A2 recovers ball in back court. Partner calls backcourt violation. I get to my partner. "Partner, we had a try... did Team A have team control after the try?" He replies, "Yes, they had team control." Me, "you're sure?" Him, "yes". I go to the throw-in spot and bounce the ball to the thrower. After the game I tell him I think we kicked that one. He says that yeah, he guesses we did. If it was a critical moment in the game, I would have probably slowed him down more, maybe review the sequence of events and try to get the correct outcome. Any advice on language/techniques to get partner amenable to changing? Seems that in the moment he was committed to his call, and not eager to analyze. |
last touched, first touched....backcourt, in my opinion....
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You could have asked your partner if any player on team A held or dribbled the ball after the try and before it was batted into the backcourt. That would have given both of you a definitive answer.
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In the couple times where establishment of TC is a factor, I don't ask if there's team control - I ask "Did a player from A control the ball?"
This requires the other official to determine if any specific player controlled the ball. |
"Partner, she never came close to controlling the ball, she only batted it. Are you sure you're happy with the call?"
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You know the call was kicked. That is not the point of this post. I think that you did about all that you can do. You asked your partner if he was sure and you were trying to seek clarification.
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"partner, when did Team A establish/regain team control?"....
"team control requires actual possesion of the ball or control of the ball, i.e. dribbling...did any player on Team have possession? did any player control the ball while dribbling? this is a critical point in the game...are you SURE that Team A had control?" if your partner does not change his call, then it is a judgement call that may or may not come back to haunt him. |
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NO TEAM CONTROL established after try keep readng for further reinforcement of this concept... |
I like this...
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I like this...
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Could also go with a mixture (with JeffPea) of "Partner, I never saw them REGAIN team control, only batting. When did you see them hold or dribble?" |
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We had this happen in my Boys Freshmen game on Wednesday. I'm trail, my partner's lead. A is offense, B is defense. Shot goes up, misses, players trying to rebound and eventually the ball gets to the floor and someone just batted the ball to the backcourt. I couldn't see who it was, as it was outside the lane opposite to me where my partner would have had the better view. Ball goes almost to the opposite endline and the A1 regained possession. Not having any clue if there was any absolute team control I didn't blow anything and left that up to my partner to call. He blew his whistle and called backcourt. We got together and I asked him what he saw as I couldn't see anything. He said that the ball was on the ground and during the "fight for the ball" A2 pushed the ball into the back court with one hand. I told him good call, as it was with intent to get it away from the opponents and to a teammate. |
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Rep, look in the rule book under player control. Rule is 4-12. Your partner did not make a good call.
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2) See #1. Wrong call by your partner and wrong interpretation of the rule by you.. |
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Might..... |
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Read the definition of pass. |
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No different from a throw in by A in front court, ball touched by A1, rolls into backcourt, and picked up by A2 in BC The fans go nuts, but no BC violation.
You have to have front court control established for a BC violation to be called. This did not happen in this case...no violation. |
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4.15 COMMENT: It is not possible for a player to travel during a dribble. A player is not dribbling while slapping the ball during a jump, when a pass rebounds from his/her hand, when he/she fumbles, or when he/she bats a rebound or pass away from other players who are attempting to get it. The player is not in control under these conditions. |
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Be a lurker for a bit and listen to the vets on here (you'll know who they are after awhile). That and learning from your mistakes is how you're going to learn. |
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Your pattern of posting goes like this: somebody posts a question, you post an answer off the top of your head, that answer's wrong and you're called on it, you post "my bad." Why not skip that initial post and just look up the answer first? Just a suggestion. :) |
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