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bas2456 Tue Jan 19, 2010 10:32pm
Illinois Online Evaluations
 
I'm in my first year with the IHSA, and at my game tonight, we had one varsity official come in to the locker room with us at halftime. We got to talking, and he volunteered to put in evaluations for both my partner and I.

How does this process work?

slow whistle Tue Jan 19, 2010 10:39pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by bas2456 (Post 653518)
I'm in my first year with the IHSA, and at my game tonight, we had one varsity official come in to the locker room with us at halftime. We got to talking, and he volunteered to put in evaluations for both my partner and I.

How does this process work?
Any certified ("C") official can rate any other official one time per season on the girls side and once on the boys side. Coaches also rate you for games that you work of theirs. These ratings are compiled and a formula is applied based on total number of ratings as well as the scores of those ratings, and you then get a composite rating for boys/girls. The ratings go from 1-this official is qualified to work state finals to 5-this official is qualified to work underclass contests only. If you go on the website you can view your composite rating score as well as the formula for computing. It is completely anonymous (at least it better be!:))

fullor30 Tue Jan 19, 2010 10:42pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by bas2456 (Post 653518)
I'm in my first year with the IHSA, and at my game tonight, we had one varsity official come in to the locker room with us at halftime. We got to talking, and he volunteered to put in evaluations for both my partner and I.

How does this process work?
As a certified official, he can 'rate' you. Basically, the more ratings you pile up, the better your chances for post season games. Coaches also can rate you. It's become somewhat of popularity contest, with officials trading ratings with their peers. If you don't get on the treadmill, you lose.

Officials who are chasing the Holy Grail of working downstate really work the system and acrue in some cases close to 200 ratings. I don't pay attention to it as I don't aspire to join the rat race. Sadly, on the varsity level, many coaches fail to rate their officials.

JRutledge Tue Jan 19, 2010 10:43pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by bas2456 (Post 653518)
I'm in my first year with the IHSA, and at my game tonight, we had one varsity official come in to the locker room with us at halftime. We got to talking, and he volunteered to put in evaluations for both my partner and I.

How does this process work?
If you are talking about the IHSA process, this is a rating system not an evaluation system. It is also meant for only varsity contests, not lower level contests. Only Certified officials and varsity schools (usually the head coach) are allowed to rate officials.

Ratings go like this:

1--State Final Official
2--Sectional Official
3--Regional Official
4--Varsity Official
5--Lower Level Official (and must accompany some written information)

I know people that will rate officials at any level, but personally I have a problem with that. For one you should not get rated for working a contest in which is not equivalent to what the rating is for in the first place. And it is not fair to judge you in a situation when you will not likely be working 3 Person during the game. Two person has a completely different set of challenges that 3 Person does not. And since all playoff games are 3 Person, it is also kind of not right to judge you based on many factors you will not experience. And as a certified official, the state has made it clear they do not want X and R officials to be rated 1s and 2s when they will never work a state final and working a Sectional is also pretty impossible.

Peace

slow whistle Tue Jan 19, 2010 10:44pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by fullor30 (Post 653524)
As a certified official, he can 'rate' you. Basically, the more ratings you pile up, the better your chances for post season games. Coaches also can rate you. It's become somewhat of popularity contest, with officials trading ratings with their peers. If you don't get on the treadmill, you lose.

Officials who are chasing the Holy Grail of working downstate really work the system and acrue in some cases close to 200 ratings. I don't pay attention to it as I don't aspire to join the rat race. Sadly, on the varsity level, many coaches fail to rate their officials.
Speaking of which I don't think you have rated me yet this year! I'll take one for last Sat:D

fullor30 Tue Jan 19, 2010 10:49pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by slow whistle (Post 653526)
Speaking of which I don't think you have rated me yet this year! I'll take one for last Sat:D

For that park district game in Mooseheart????

JRutledge Tue Jan 19, 2010 10:51pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by fullor30 (Post 653524)
As a certified official, he can 'rate' you. Basically, the more ratings you pile up, the better your chances for post season games. Coaches also can rate you. It's become somewhat of popularity contest, with officials trading ratings with their peers. If you don't get on the treadmill, you lose.
This is not really true. The part about the more ratings you get the more likely you will get playoffs. It is only 5 points in a 40 point system. If your overall Power Rating is high it does not really matter what your game ratings are. You have to have some other things high and you are competing against other officials in your area. It is true the more ratings the higher your "game" ratings will be, but this is only one part of the process. And honestly, if you do not have some other things going for you, your ratings will not help you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fullor30 (Post 653524)
Officials who are chasing the Holy Grail of working downstate really work the system and acrue in some cases close to 200 ratings. I don't pay attention to it as I don't aspire to join the rat race. Sadly, on the varsity level, many coaches fail to rate their officials.
I can only speak of what I know but 200 would be extremely high for those that have worked the State Finals (at least on the boy's side). Actually if you have 50 ratings that is probably rather high. I know some that have higher, but they are the minority based on what I have seen. I say this because the last couple of years I have close to 80 total game ratings and I had more ratings than many guys had that have worked the state finals. And I have only worked a Sectional (the second tier of our system for those outside of Illinois). You have to have other things like Top 15 percentages, ranking (C, R, X) and even a certain number of varsity games as well.

Peace

slow whistle Tue Jan 19, 2010 10:56pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by JRutledge (Post 653533)
This is not really true. The part about the more ratings you get the more likely you will get playoffs. It is only 5 points in a 40 point system. If your overall Power Rating is high it does not really matter what your game ratings are. You have to have some other things high and you are competing against other officials in your area. It is true the more ratings the higher your "game" ratings will be, but this is only one part of the process. And honestly, if you do not have some other things going for you, your ratings will not help you.



I can only speak of what I know but 200 would be extremely high for those that have worked the State Finals (at least on the boy's side). Actually if you have 50 ratings that is probably rather high. I know some that have higher, but they are the minority based on what I have seen. I say this because the last couple of years I have close to 80 total game ratings and I had more ratings than many guys had that have worked the state finals. And I have only worked a Sectional (the second tier of our system for those outside of Illinois). You have to have other things like Top 15 percentages, ranking (C, R, X) and even a certain number of varsity games as well.

Peace
The coaches are the ones who drive me crazy. Here is an opportunity for them to have a say (at least in theory) about the officials who work their games and in my experience they do next to nothing about it. I think I have done around 15 boys games this year and a grand total of 5 coach ratings out of a possible 30!

slow whistle Tue Jan 19, 2010 10:57pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by fullor30 (Post 653531)
For that park district game in Mooseheart????
You laugh but they put on a helluva halftime show. The Moosettes are something to behold.

fullor30 Tue Jan 19, 2010 11:04pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by JRutledge (Post 653533)
This is not really true. The part about the more ratings you get the more likely you will get playoffs. It is only 5 points in a 40 point system. If your overall Power Rating is high it does not really matter what your game ratings are. You have to have some other things high and you are competing against other officials in your area. It is true the more ratings the higher your "game" ratings will be, but this is only one part of the process. And honestly, if you do not have some other things going for you, your ratings will not help you.



I can only speak of what I know but 200 would be extremely high for those that have worked the State Finals (at least on the boy's side). Actually if you have 50 ratings that is probably rather high. I know some that have higher, but they are the minority based on what I have seen. I say this because the last couple of years I have close to 80 total game ratings and I had more ratings than many guys had that have worked the state finals. And I have only worked a Sectional (the second tier of our system for those outside of Illinois). You have to have other things like Top 15 percentages, ranking (C, R, X) and even a certain number of varsity games as well.

Peace
To be honest, I don't fully understand the whole rating system. Someone told me about an official that has over 150 ratings in already. Sounds impossible, yet some guys are handing out numbers to any certified official in sight.

Again, it does bug me that coaches fail to submit their ratings by years end, but what's new?

JRutledge Tue Jan 19, 2010 11:06pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by slow whistle (Post 653537)
The coaches are the ones who drive me crazy. Here is an opportunity for them to have a say (at least in theory) about the officials who work their games and in my experience they do next to nothing about it. I think I have done around 15 boys games this year and a grand total of 5 coach ratings out of a possible 30!
I agree, but since this is only a small part of the process I do not worry or concern myself with this. I should have over 100 every year and about a 1/3 of the ratings never come in. I have 15 coaches’ ratings right now and I have worked 32 games as of yesterday. And I have 17 Official's ratings. Now I do not think they post all of them weekly, so there might be many more in the office and not published, but I certainly should have more than I do right now. But it is what it is and I try not to worry about things that I cannot control. I was observed by someone last Friday; I can control what I show them. Those things sometimes mean more than the ratings you actually get.

Peace

fullor30 Tue Jan 19, 2010 11:12pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by JRutledge (Post 653543)
I agree, but since this is only a small part of the process I do not worry or concern myself with this. I should have over 100 every year and about a 1/3 of the ratings never come in. I have 15 coaches’ ratings right now and I have worked 32 games as of yesterday. And I have 17 Official's ratings. Now I do not think they post all of them weekly, so there might be many more in the office and not published, but I certainly should have more than I do right now. But it is what it is and I try not to worry about things that I cannot control. I was observed by someone last Friday; I can control what I show them. Those things sometimes mean more than the ratings you actually get.

Peace
I know of one coach in my area who claims he submits all his ratings at years end. He purposely doesn't rate an official 'freshly' after a game as to take the emotion out of his rating.

JRutledge Tue Jan 19, 2010 11:15pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by fullor30 (Post 653542)
To be honest, I don't fully understand the whole rating system. Someone told me about an official that has over 150 ratings in already. Sounds impossible, yet some guys are handing out numbers to any certified official in sight.

Again, it does bug me that coaches fail to submit their ratings by years end, but what's new?
I can tell you based on many state final officials; many do not get any more than 50. And some of this is based on what part of the state they are from. I work with two guys that worked a Super-Sectional last year and I had more ratings than each of those officials individually. And these were guys that worked many more Sectionals than I might ever get in my career. Then again they live in a different area. And they were shocked when I told them my numbers.

Peace

fullor30 Wed Jan 20, 2010 09:13am
Quote:
Originally Posted by JRutledge (Post 653549)
I can tell you based on many state final officials; many do not get any more than 50. And some of this is based on what part of the state they are from. I work with two guys that worked a Super-Sectional last year and I had more ratings than each of those officials individually. And these were guys that worked many more Sectionals than I might ever get in my career. Then again they live in a different area. And they were shocked when I told them my numbers.

Peace
Do you think it's partially due to the amount of tournies in our area that I'm sure you work plenty of where there are officials coming and going so It's possible to pick up 9-12 ratings in a day? This may not be the case in more rural areas.

tjones1 Wed Jan 20, 2010 09:31am
I have worked 23 boys game this year so far. I only have 10 ratings from coaches and 20 from officials.

In my opinion, I certainly picked up most of my ratings from the holiday tournaments.

BubbaRef Wed Jan 20, 2010 10:33am
I have worked 18 boys games so far and have 6 ratings from coaches and 8 from officials. I also have worked 17 girls games and have 12 coaches and 13 officials.

I did work a girls Super last year and had a total of 33 coaches and 16 officials. I normally work about 30 games each in boys and girls and always have under half the games rated by coaches. I know a few years ago I was working a boys game and the coach told me to make sure we got our names and numbers in the book because he was on probation from not rating officials. Not sure what they can do to a coach if he is on probation and doesnt rate officials.

I do know a few coaches who do wait until the end of the year to rate officials just like it was mentioned above, but most wait a few days to do it.

They do take all of the ratings in to consideration but I think more so the power rating than anything. But if you think you have the IHSA figured out then they do something to make you think otherwise. Getting seen by the IHSA helps a bunch also. They also talk to officials that have worked the state tourney about other officials.

JRutledge Wed Jan 20, 2010 12:33pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by fullor30 (Post 653601)
Do you think it's partially due to the amount of tournies in our area that I'm sure you work plenty of where there are officials coming and going so It's possible to pick up 9-12 ratings in a day? This may not be the case in more rural areas.
I honestly do not have a good answer for that. I do not work a lot of tourneys in our area. A lot of what I work is out of the area. I do think I pick up some ratings because I am known well in those other places and some of the conferences I work help. But coaches just do not put in enough ratings all over the place. As I said I have more ratings than some of my more rural counterparts that I know of. I cannot say it is for one reason.

Peace

JoeT Thu Jan 21, 2010 09:37am
Quote:
Originally Posted by fullor30 (Post 653524)
Officials who are chasing the Holy Grail of working downstate really work the system...
Reminds me -

At one school where I was AD and head coach, there was one official who'd send out letters (real paper letters!) every year to solicit ratings....

He shall remain nameless, but I'll bet you the Chicagoland folks here know!


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