Hugh Refner NF rules. A1 passes to A2. A2 bats (not catches) the ball down to the floor and pins it there. While his hands are on top of the ball pressing down, he drops to his knees. Travel? Remember, he's wasn't "holding" the ball when his knees touched the floor, just pushing on it. Is there a difference?
tjones1 4-44 Traveling (running with the ball) is moving a foot or feet in any direction in excess of prescribed limits while holding the ball.
Anchor Player is in control. There is no definition for "holding the ball" though the description meets the basic qualifications a held ball (4-25). I vote for traveling (though it is not a hill I am willing to die on).
mbyron tjones1 wrote4-44 traveling (running with the ball) is moving a foot or feet in any direction in excess of prescribed limits while holding the ball. +1
BktBallRef Anchor wrotePlayer is in control. There is no definition for "holding the ball" though the description meets the basic qualifications a held ball (4-25). I vote for traveling (though it is not a hill I am willing to die on). Ah, you might want to read the definition in the post prior to yours, where it says traveling occurs while "holding the ball."
Adam A1 gets control on the floor, sets it down next to him, then gets up. This is a travel. Had the player held it first, prior to pinning it, you could justify a travel call based on the inverse of this play. Good case Hugh, play on though.
just another ref Snaqwells wroteA1 gets control on the floor, sets it down next to him, then gets up. This is a travel. Had the player held it first, prior to pinning it, you could justify a travel call based on the inverse of this play. I don't get it.
Anchor BktBallRef wroteAh, you might want to read the definition in the post prior to yours, where it says traveling occurs while "holding the ball." He pins the ball to the floor and runs a little circle around it. Travel or no? "Holding the ball" does not necessarily have to mean that he has it gripped tightly between 2 hands.
Adam Anchor wroteHe pins the ball to the floor and runs a little circle around it. Travel or no? "Holding the ball" does not necessarily have to mean that he has it gripped tightly between 2 hands. Let me ask you this, would you grant a TO if he was pinning the ball to the floor?
just another ref Snaqwells wroteLet me ask you this, would you grant a TO if he was pinning the ball to the floor? If you hadn't asked this question, I probably would have, but now I wouldn't. The player with the ball pinned is neither holding nor dribbling it. There is no player control, so no timeout.
Anchor Snaqwells wroteLet me ask you this, would you grant a TO if he was pinning the ball to the floor? Actually was going to use that question instead, but the thought of the guy leaning on his arm running around in circles was more amusing. Answer, if his hand was on top of the ball and he had it forcefully pinned (which is the way I have pretty much pictured this whole scenario) I would most likely grant the TO.
mbyron Anchor wrote Answer, if his hand was on top of the ball and he had it forcefully pinned (which is the way I have pretty much pictured this whole scenario) I would most likely grant the TO. Which criterion of 'player control' has this player satisfied?
FrankHtown Ok...player has hands big enought to palm the basketball. Now, is the player holding it, even though it's on the floor?
slow whistle FrankHtown wroteOk...player has hands big enought to palm the basketball. Now, is the player holding it, even though it's on the floor? Are his fingers closed around it? Have to judge whether or not he is controlling it, I am probably saying he is not unless he is obviously palming it and moving it around....a htbt for sure...
Forksref Anchor wrotePlayer is in control. There is no definition for "holding the ball" though the description meets the basic qualifications a held ball (4-25). I vote for traveling (though it is not a hill I am willing to die on). NOPE Does not meet the "basic qualifications a held ball." Held ball must be by OPPONENTS - Read 4-25 again.
Anchor mbyron wroteWhich criterion of 'player control' has this player satisfied? If the defender did a belly slide and grabbed the ball on each side while the guy had his hand on top would it be a held ball?
FrankHtown Great point, Anchor. If the player on the floor could contest the defender taking the ball, then yes...he was "holding " the ball.
tjones1 Well, yes, but... 4-25 HELD BALL A held ball occurs when: 4-25-1 Opponents have their hands so firmly on the ball that control cannot be obtained without undue roughness. It doesn't say they are "holding"...