OT: Contacting an official
 

It's OT, because it's football. I'm watching the Broncos go through part of the process of pissing their playoff hopes away (won't be complete until next week), and Brandon Stokely just took exception to a no-call on what he thought was pass interference. He ran about 40 yards to confront the Back Judge.

As he walked away in disgust, he threw his arms, contacting the official's outstretched hand.

Bye-bye

Yep, easy call, REAL stupid move.

did he get ejected? I didn't catch that because I'm flipping through channels. Eagles fan here, but this game is a definite win and my interest isn't high enough to keep it on.

Yep. He got tossed. Stupid move for a veteran player.

My brother just told me he saw it happen in the other room. He said it didn't look like it was intentional and that it probably shouldn't have been an ejection.

I don't know though, I didn't see it but will probably see it on ESPN or Comcast SN tomorrow morning

Stokely INTENTIONALLY swung in the direction of the official.

Just like I tell my kids, don't throw rocks in the neighborhood and then say it's an accident when you break a window.

Whether he hit him intentionally doesn't matter. Did he aim for him? No. Did he swing purposefully in the direction of the official's hand? Definitely. He did it in anger, and I'm pretty sure it was preceded by some choice words. My understanding is that contacting an official is a judgment-free call.

Kind of has to be, doesn't it? Last thing we need is any kind of debate about whether someone "accidentally" hit an official - that just raises the possibility of getting away with taking a shot if you can pretend it was an "accident".

That's exactly right. I can't wait to hear the local sports radio guys complain about it tomorrow on my way home from work, though.

Video of Brandon Stokley Ref Contact and Ejection

Not sure honestly -- I don't know what he said and that alone could've been grounds for dismissal... but the contacting the official here seems a little finger to finger to me... I really don't know.

I predict that the league will use the expression "zero tolerance."

And they should
 

It was just stupid.

Please replay and get back to us.

That one is a no-brainer in ANY league. You do NOT contact any official that way. You start letting things like that go and it's open season on officials.

You telling me if a player does this to you, you're not automatically dumping the player? This one seemed pretty cut and dry to me.

Watching the replay, this is a lot more straightforward than I though. Looked to me like he intentionally slapped his hand. No brainer, on both their parts.

My wife heard me cheer when they tossed him, and asked what happened.

Me: "They just ejected one of the Broncos."

Wife: :confused: "Why are you happy?"

Me: Because he got stupid and deserved it.

I'll repeat my earlier reply for you:

Just like I tell my kids, don't throw rocks in the neighborhood and then say it's an accident when you break a window.

After watching the video, I'd have to agree. Although not intentionally hitting the official, any contact against an official in any sport (except coaches in baseball apparently) should be zero tolerance. I'm sure some words he said could have influenced the ejection as well.

And before anyone says anything, I know some of you may reference back to my post last week about a player making contact with me and I didn't eject him. That was my fault and I don't need a reminder. :o

I will say there's a difference between contacting an official to show him what you think happened (a T, and perhaps a flagrant) and the OP, which was hitting an official in anger/frustration.

Disagree. Football umpires get knocked down all the time.

A helpful distinction (though not exhaustive) would be live-ball vs. dead-ball contact.

Naw, that distinction doesn't really help either imo. The distinction in any sport at any time is whether the contact was incidental/accidental or deliberate and unsporting.

I got bumped into in the FRA the other night by a kid who was being subbed out. He was walking backwards and didn't see me. So are you guys saying that I should have tossed him?

If the contact is intentional than the player or coach is gone. It's simple.

I would say no. You are talking about something that happens all the time versus making contact while complaining, etc.

pretty clear intentional for me . The 30 yard rush with a full head of steam was already as unsportsmanlike as you can get IMO,then turn and slap the hand .i was mad just seeing it. i'm impressed with the calm , professional response and reporting as well , god call, good ref:o

I agree what he said may have been enough to get him ejected but contacting the official is as dumb a move as you can make. Whether the contact is severe or not it doesn't matter he has to go.

Exactly, which is why I was cheering even though it was my team getting penalized. Proof positive to me that I'm watching all these games as an official.

That is true. I was meaning in a dissenting way. I got run over by a player a few weeks ago in a JH game. I'm not going to eject him because it was clearly an accident. I didn't know he was there and he didn't know I was there.

Sorry for not being clear. I meant only when a player or coach is clearly showing dissent while such contact, accidental or intentional, occurs.

That is true. The problem for referees is when it is not CLEARLY intentional and could have been accidental, which is not that simple. As someone mentioned earlier, zero tolerance policy helps so we don't have to guess if it was intentional or not.

In your case with the sub, no ejection. It happens to all of us in basketball. If you asked that after my post before yours, I apologize for not being clear.

I just thought of something. Never happened to me, I've seen it done in professional and college football with the "touchdown" signal.

Shooter shoots a three and makes it. I have both of my hands up to signal a successful three point shot. Player comes over and slaps my hands as a high five touch. Technical?

Hmmm. Not the first time, I don't think. My first instinct on this is a very stern warning to the player not to do that in the future.

hm, I would probably do the same thing. I'm not very sure. But if you did T him up, the coach would be more mad towards the player and not you, wouldn't you agree?

Sounds like something out of the "High Stress Ref" video. :D

Your kidding right?

not really, why?

What do we read before each game?

Sportsmanship Message:
"Actions meant to demean opposing contestants, teams, spectators, and OFFICIALS are not in the highest ideals of interscholastic education and will not be tolerated."

Coaches should know that and be mad at their own players for their stupidity. If a coach were to get mad at me, I'll just say "hey coach, you were there when I (or my partner) read the sportsmanship message before the game."

If you think the act was meant to demean you, then you're right. I don't see it that way, though. I see it as one of two things, most likely.

1. Taunting.
2. Emotional reaction to a big shot; and he sees a hand and thinks it's a teammate.

As the new lead, though, he'd have to chase me down to give me a high five, and by the time he reached me my hands would be down. If I'm C, maybe possible, but my hands are only up for a couple of seconds.

Taunting who? the referee or the opponent? Either way it would be unsporting.

But like you said, I would have to see how it worked out. Stern warning would suffice enough.

That's where i got the question. Towards the end one of the players comes up and gives a high five or ten and they do all that hand clapping routine stuff.

If you whacked a kid for giving you a high-five I don't believe the initial reaction from the coach will be to chew the player @ss. That's why I said, "Are you kidding?" I am not debating the validity of the T itself. I just can't see you not getting an ear full first.

Just depends on who the coach is. I know my high school coach would have torn my arm off and bludgeoned me with it before the official could whack me...

I Hope I Don't Get Ejected, Or Worse, Arrested ...
 

Since the introduction of the alternating possession arrow, the following has happened to me on two occasions. I call a held ball, while my thumbs are still up in the air, I look intently at the arrow at the table, and respond by immediately bringing an arm down to point in the proper direction, hitting a player on the head.

3. Player being a smart ***. That would be why I would do it. ;)