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-   -   definition of an undershirt (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/55637-definition-undershirt.html)

constable Thu Dec 03, 2009 12:25am

definition of an undershirt
 
I saw a kid wearing a white jersey with a black sleeveless shirt. Nothing stuck out of the arm hole of his jersey.

My partner said it's good to go since it's not technically an undershirt- it has to have sleeves in order to be an undershirt.

I'm at works- books are at home. Thoughts?

tjones1 Thu Dec 03, 2009 01:07am

I think your partner was incorrect. It states if the undershirt has sleeves; therefore, they don't have to have them to qualify as an undershirt.

3-5-5

Undershirts shall be a single solid color similar to the torso of the jersey and shall be hemmed and not have frayed or ragged edges. If the undershirt has sleeves, they shall be the same length. A visible manufacturer's logo/trademark/reference is not permitted on the undershirt.

Back In The Saddle Thu Dec 03, 2009 01:13am

If it's worn on the torso, it's a shirt. If it's worn under the jersey, it's an undershirt. The lack of sleeves does not somehow make it some other kind of garment. And the rule Tanner quoted clearly acknowledges that when it says, "If the undershirt has sleeves...".

Nevadaref Thu Dec 03, 2009 04:21am

Quote:

Originally Posted by constable (Post 639281)
I saw a kid wearing a white jersey with a black sleeveless shirt. Nothing stuck out of the arm hole of his jersey.

My partner said it's good to go since it's not technically an undershirt- it has to have sleeves in order to be an undershirt.

I'm at works- books are at home. Thoughts?

There was an NFHS document a couple of years ago (a preseason guide, I believe) which showed that an undershirt was illegal if it was an impermissible color and showed in the V-neck portion of the team jersey. The fact that it had no sleeves didn't matter. If it could be seen in any way, then it was not to be worn if it didn't meet the color requirement.

BillyMac Thu Dec 03, 2009 07:28am

The New Black ...
 
http://thm-a01.yimg.com/image/97ddc0224371719a

Bishopcolle Thu Dec 03, 2009 09:08am

Sports Bras???
 
I hate to utter this, but colored sports bras (slightly visible under the jersey), do they have to match the color of the jersey? They almost appear to be an undershirt, and are causing a little stir here in Utah.....

BktBallRef Thu Dec 03, 2009 09:12am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bishopcolle (Post 639310)
I hate to utter this, but colored sports bras (slightly visible under the jersey), do they have to match the color of the jersey? They almost appear to be an undershirt, and are causing a little stir here in Utah.....

Why? A bra is NOT an undershirt and is not covered by the rule.

I would suggest ignoring the sports bra.

bob jenkins Thu Dec 03, 2009 09:42am

Quote:

Originally Posted by BktBallRef (Post 639311)
Why? A bra is NOT an undershirt and is not covered by the rule.

I would suggest ignoring the sports bra.

Agreed.

And the same *might* be true of the sleeveless undershirt, depending on the style of the jersey and the style of the undershirt.

Nevadaref Thu Dec 03, 2009 05:34pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bishopcolle (Post 639310)
I hate to utter this, but colored sports bras (slightly visible under the jersey), do they have to match the color of the jersey? They almost appear to be an undershirt, and are causing a little stir here in Utah.....

What are you going to do about it, have her take it off? :eek:

Adam Thu Dec 03, 2009 05:39pm

I'd feel creepy even bringing it up.

BillyMac Thu Dec 03, 2009 09:00pm

Victoria's Secret, Not A Secret Anymore ...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Bishopcolle (Post 639310)
I hate to utter this, but colored sports bras (slightly visible under the jersey), do they have to match the color of the jersey? They almost appear to be an undershirt, and are causing a little stir here in Utah.

Why are you looking there?:)

I worked a scrimmage last weekend involving several teams in two gyms. Two teams walked into my gym wearing white reversible scrimmage vests. One coach immediately told his players to change. They did what they were told. Right there in front of everbody. I guess that I'm just too old fashioned, I looked away.

BillyMac Thu Dec 03, 2009 09:01pm

Lobbing Softballs ...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 639486)
I'd feel creepy even bringing it up.

Another straight line for Mark Padgett.

Chess Ref Thu Dec 03, 2009 11:18pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 639486)
I'd feel creepy even bringing it up.

I had a partner last year who wanted to go there. :)

I made a pretty convincing argument of why it was venturing into creepy old guy territory.:rolleyes:

He left it alone. :)

tjones1 Thu Dec 03, 2009 11:38pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by chess ref (Post 639535)
i had a partner last year who wanted to go there. :)

i made a pretty convincing argument of why it was venturing into creepy old guy territory.:rolleyes:

He left it alone. :)

+1

Adam Thu Dec 03, 2009 11:44pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chess Ref (Post 639535)
I had a partner last year who wanted to go there. :)

I made a pretty convincing argument of why it was venturing into creepy old guy territory.:rolleyes:

He left it alone. :)

Thank God for legitimate common sense, even if it has to be coaxed out of dormancy. I'd be tempted to ask a partner if he had candy in his panel van if he insisted on going that route.

In all seriousness, with undershirts, you can make them take them off if they don't match the uniform. That's not an option with sports bras.


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