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-   -   Did we get it right? (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/55333-did-we-get-right.html)

zac Sun Nov 08, 2009 11:19pm

Did we get it right?
 
A1 try in the air. A2 fouls B1 after shot, but before made goal. B not in the bonus. We counted the 2 points for A, reported the foul on A2, and continued with a B throw-in. Just checking. Thanks

Nevadaref Mon Nov 09, 2009 12:06am

Quote:

Originally Posted by zac (Post 635101)
A1 try in the air. A2 fouls B1 after shot, but before made goal. B not in the bonus. We counted the 2 points for A, reported the foul on A2, and continued with a B throw-in. Just checking. Thanks

Yes, and Team B may run the end line during the throw-in.

BktBallRef Mon Nov 09, 2009 12:25am

Quote:

Originally Posted by zac (Post 635101)
A1 try in the air. A2 fouls B1 after shot, but before made goal. B not in the bonus. We counted the 2 points for A, reported the foul on A2, and continued with a B throw-in. Just checking. Thanks

As long as the ball was released before A2's foul, you got it right.

Nevadaref Mon Nov 09, 2009 04:00am

Quote:

Originally Posted by BktBallRef (Post 635107)
As long as the ball was released before A2's foul, you got it right.

Quote:

Originally Posted by zac (Post 635101)
A1 try in the air. A2 fouls B1 after shot, but before made goal. B not in the bonus. We counted the 2 points for A, reported the foul on A2, and continued with a B throw-in. Just checking. Thanks

;)

mbyron Mon Nov 09, 2009 07:42am

I take it that BktBallRef was merely emphasizing the importance of the order for this particular play. As posted, they got it right. If the foul had happened first, it would have been TC, dead ball, no shot.

What's the call if they happen simultaneously? :D

grunewar Mon Nov 09, 2009 08:33am

Quote:

Originally Posted by mbyron (Post 635127)
What's the call if they happen simultaneously? :D

Ya get with your partner(s) and make sure one happened just a split second before the other, report it, and move on.

Troublemaker! ;)

bob jenkins Mon Nov 09, 2009 08:53am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nevadaref (Post 635106)
Yes, and Team B may run the end line during the throw-in.

What if the foul didn't happen near the end-line?

Quote:

Originally Posted by mbyron (Post 635127)
What's the call if they happen simultaneously? :D

Impossible, by rule.

Indianaref Mon Nov 09, 2009 09:20am

Quote:

Originally Posted by bob jenkins (Post 635141)
What if the foul didn't happen near the end-line?

7-5 ART. 7 . . . After a goal or awarded goal as in 7-4-3, the team not credited with the score shall make the throw-in from the end of the court where the goal was made and from any point outside the end line.

Adam Mon Nov 09, 2009 10:08am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Indianaref (Post 635146)
7-5 ART. 7 . . . After a goal or awarded goal as in 7-4-3, the team not credited with the score shall make the throw-in from the end of the court where the goal was made and from any point outside the end line.

Look for the rule dealing with the throwin spots. If you just go by this rule, then B would get the ball even if they committed a foul.

eg-italy Mon Nov 09, 2009 10:19am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 635151)
Look for the rule dealing with the throwin spots. If you just go by this rule, then B would get the ball even if they committed a foul.

Really? :confused: You must be joking. :)

Adam Mon Nov 09, 2009 10:30am

Quote:

Originally Posted by eg-italy (Post 635157)
Really? :confused: You must be joking. :)

Not joking so much as making a point. My point was the rule quoted doesn't really apply to this situation, or the result would be as I posted.

The R Mon Nov 09, 2009 10:32am

Similar
 
Had something similar this weekend....A1 drives the lane and shoots. B1 comes running over from middle of the lane and attempts to block shot. A1 returns to the floor and then is run over by B1 whose momentum carried him through A1.

I whistle the foul from lead. My partner tells me the shot went in. So we count the basket and A has a throw-in from the point of the interruption since A1 had returned to the floor and was no longer an airborne shooter.

bob jenkins Mon Nov 09, 2009 10:42am

Quote:

Originally Posted by The R (Post 635164)
A has a throw-in from the point of the interruption

How does POI enter into this play?

The R Mon Nov 09, 2009 10:46am

Quote:

Originally Posted by bob jenkins (Post 635167)
How does POI enter into this play?

Where else would you have the throwin from?

just another ref Mon Nov 09, 2009 10:56am

Quote:

Ya get with your partner(s) and make sure one happened just a split second before the other, report it, and move on.

Just like on a blarge.

Quote:


Impossible, by rule.
Just like a blarge.

BktBallRef Mon Nov 09, 2009 10:57am

Quote:

Originally Posted by mbyron (Post 635127)
I take it that BktBallRef was merely emphasizing the importance of the order for this particular play. As posted, they got it right. If the foul had happened first, it would have been TC, dead ball, no shot.

Exactly. NVRef is just being his normal smartass know-it-all self.

just another ref Mon Nov 09, 2009 10:59am

Quote:

Originally Posted by The R (Post 635172)
Where else would you have the throwin from?


Throw-in is from the spot nearest the foul. POI has nothing to do with it.

The R Mon Nov 09, 2009 11:10am

Quote:

Originally Posted by just another ref (Post 635177)
Throw-in is from the spot nearest the foul. POI has nothing to do with it.

I see what you are saying I was using POI because the game was interrupted. We are talking about the spot on the floor though.

Adam Mon Nov 09, 2009 11:24am

Quote:

Originally Posted by The R (Post 635180)
I see what you are saying I was using POI because the game was interrupted. We are talking about the spot on the floor though.

Sure it was interrupted, just like any time you blow the whistle. But just for kicks, wouldn't the POI have been a throwin for the non-scoring team? Instead you rightly gave the ball to A at the spot of the foul.

The R Mon Nov 09, 2009 11:44am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 635181)
Sure it was interrupted, just like any time you blow the whistle. But just for kicks, wouldn't the POI have been a throwin for the non-scoring team? Instead you rightly gave the ball to A at the spot of the foul.

It would if scoring a basket is an interruption to the game.

Adam Mon Nov 09, 2009 12:31pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by The R (Post 635188)
It would if scoring a basket is an interruption to the game.

The point of POI is to put the ball back where it would have gone had the game not been interrupted. IOW, how do we move on as if it didn't happen. Every time POI is used (double fouls, accidental whistle, etc), that's the purpose. So the POI is not the result of the interruption.

In the play in question, the interruption is the foul, the POI is the basket and ensuing throwin.

bob jenkins Mon Nov 09, 2009 12:37pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by The R (Post 635172)
Where else would you have the throwin from?

The spot nearest the foul.

POI is used only when there's a double foul, an inadvertant whistle, a correctable error, ...

It's not used when there's a single foul (except for most single non-flagrant T's in NCAA) or a false double foul, ....

So, it's not relevant in your play.

Terminology matters.

The R Mon Nov 09, 2009 02:08pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by bob jenkins (Post 635202)
The spot nearest the foul.

POI is used only when there's a double foul, an inadvertant whistle, a correctable error, ...

It's not used when there's a single foul (except for most single non-flagrant T's in NCAA) or a false double foul, ....

So, it's not relevant in your play.

Terminology matters.

I see what you mean. I was applying the literal sense of the word interruption from the definition of POI.

So no there was no application of POI by definition in the play.

Nevadaref Tue Nov 10, 2009 04:05am

Quote:

Originally Posted by bob jenkins (Post 635141)
What if the foul didn't happen near the end-line?

Good point, bob.

If the foul by A2 took place in a location on the floor which would not result in a throw-in somewhere along the end line of Team B's backcourt, then the throw-in would simply be a designated-spot throw-in from the OOB location nearest to where the foul was committed.

That was something worth pointing out to people.

cdaref Tue Nov 10, 2009 02:26pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by bob jenkins (Post 635141)
What if the foul didn't happen near the end-line?.

Oooo. Good question.

My gut says spot throw in from the appropriate spot determined by the location of the foul. BUT that would in a way permit the fouling team to gain an advantage, so to speak, of negating the advantage team B would have to run the endline after a made basket.

Gonna have to check the books on that. Dont have them at my desk.

[edit: serves me right to respond to the post before reading to the end of the thread to see if anyone answered the question. Thanks Nevada. -Clark]

Adam Tue Nov 10, 2009 03:43pm

Just to answer your point about the advantage; it's a wash. As an offense, would you rather have an endline throwin or a spot throwin on the sideline, further down court?


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