Another Wreck Mess......

[grunewar]

Ch1town - I'm not going to disagree with anything you wrote or apologize for my actions. Calling a timeout would have been a great idea - truly, didn't think about it. That's a great point.

This is Rec ball and regardless of how it looks I was the senior, most experienced league official and coach present - regardless of my alleged biases or predispositions I am always looked at to help run games, teach officials, observe, etc. Even if I don’t have a dog in the fight. You are right though, this time I did.

Did I overstep my bounds as an Asst Coach – by the book, absolutely. I was trying to do what is right and correct for the league. I'm not going to let someone get injured because others are inexperienced and don't know what to do.

I sent a note similar to this thread to the league Commissioner, the Head Coach (new this yr) and my Referee Assignor - if they want to discipline me, bar me, whatever - that is their prerogative. I caveated much of what I said in my email with “IMO”. They can ask others of course and I hope they do.

After every Rec Game I officiate I send a recap to the league letting them know nothing happened, something happened, etc. I have some credibility here.

Originally Posted by grunewar

Ch1town - I'm not going to disagree with anything you wrote or apologize for my actions. Calling a timeout would have been a great idea - truly, didn't think about it. That's a great point..

No sir, I'm not looking for an internet argument nor an apology You do you! I just thought it could've been a better way & wanted to see what you thought.

Originally Posted by grunewar

This is Rec ball and regardless of how it looks I was the senior, most experienced league official AND coach present...

I hear you, but it's either or on my games. My response is generally "you can not & will not wear both hats today sir/ma'am. If you want to work, I have an extra shirt & whistle in my bag."

Originally Posted by grunewar

Did I overstep my bounds as an Asst Coach – by the book, absolutely. I was trying to do what is right and correct for the league. I'm not going to let someone get injured because others are inexperienced and don't know what to do.

That is for you & your superiors to decide...
I understand the safety issue as well.

Around here kids are allowed to "play up" an age group or two & due to that experience, I've noticed how much more skilled they are when they go back to playing their own age group. Not always a bad thing.

[grunewar]

Originally Posted by Ch1town

No sir, I'm not looking for an internet argument nor an apology You do you! I just thought it could've been a better way & wanted to see what you thought.




I hear you, but it's either or on my games. My response is generally "you can not & will not wear both hats today sir/ma'am. If you want to work, I have an extra shirt & whistle in my bag."



That is for you & your superiors to decide...
I understand the safety issue as well.

Around here kids are allowed to "play up" an age group or two & due to that experience, I've noticed how much more skilled they are when they go back to playing their own age group. Not always a bad thing.

And I'm not going to argue as you bring up some great points. I would have loved to work this game, but my kid was playing and I try to avoid it. I would have gladly taken the whistle if you offered.

Your "no sir" comment is accurate, but these were two, little-experienced officials who had no idea how to handle it and had the "dear in the headlights look."

Safety is always job one.

We have a "play up" rule too in our one age group and there is merit there. But this teen would have been "playing down" an age group going from the B16/18 to the B13/15 not playing up.

I hope the folks didn't think I was an a$$, but I obviously could have handled it better as you correctly point out. I appreciate your opinion.

[IUgrad92]

I didn't see any mention of a league administrator being present. If that were true, along with teenagers coaching teenagers, I'm not sure there's enough structure in this particular league. I don't think I'd pay money to have my kid to play in this kind of league.

Am I getting the wrong picture or am what I'm picturing accurate?

[grunewar]

Originally Posted by IUgrad92

I didn't see any mention of a league administrator being present. If that were true, along with teenagers coaching teenagers, I'm not sure there's enough structure in this particular league. I don't think I'd pay money to have my kid to play in this kind of league.

Am I getting the wrong picture or am what I'm picturing accurate?

Your picture is accurate.

We've had several HS and College kids Coach as part of community service projects and done quite well. But, the league does need to be more involved and visible. It's another good point.

[BayStateRef]

I am particularly sensitive to your comment about the less experienced refs. Last year, watching a Rec game (3rd grade boys), a dad came onto the court during a live ball to challenge a ref for not stopping the game because a kid was hurt. (Turned out it was his kid who was crying.) The high school kid was working alone. He did not have the maturity or management skills to deal with the adult...who also turned out to be the league coordinator. No adult coach or other parent did anything. I did. And then I had to actually ask that this guy be suspended (he was).

You handled it fine. It is Rec. It is allowing the kids to play who are part of this program. It is not pick-up ball where anyone can play. You are allowed to wear many hats. I suspect that if your coach had tried to add an older kid to your roster, you would have not allowed it. So I have no problem with your comments or your actions.

[Mark Padgett]

Originally Posted by grunewar

and had the "dear in the headlights look."

You mean that sometimes your wife is out walking along a rural road and stares into headlights?

Or is this part of some game you two like to play? TMI.

[BillyMac]

Over twenty-five years ago, I was asked to officiate in high school boys recreation league. This league was for high school boys who either did not make the high school team, or chose not to try out for the high school team (poor grades, lack of commitment, etc.) Each team had a "captain" who also acted as the "coach". There was no adult involvement with this league at all, not even parents in the stands as fans.

The league had five teams, and all five teams would play one night a week, in three back to back to back games. Figure out the math. One of the teams in the first game was always scheduled to play in the third game as well, with the game in between as a "rest period". Well teenage boys being teenage boys, many of these players often decided to spend their "rest time" between games drinking in the parking lot.

I never gave so many technical fouls in my life. I finished my commitment to officiate in that league for that season, and then told my assigner never again. The money was very good, but it wasn't worth it.

Moral to the story: For real basketball games, with games that count, with real officials, there has to be some type of adult administrators, or coaches. Playground ball, with only players involved, no adults, is best done as just that, playground ball. Throw some real officials into a "playground" game, and this "hybrid" of "real basketball" and "playground basketball" is doomed to failure.