Language Profane, or Merely Vulgar?

[rainmaker]

Coach was yelling at me about a call, and ended up with, "...Judas Priest!!" I whacked him. I don't regret the call, but now I am wondering if this phrase would be considered profanity?

Actually, the whole situation was a triumph for me, since I responded to this coach really appropriately all through the game, and at the end, he told me I did a good job, even though I had whacked him.

I know we aren't supposed to believe it when a coach says we did a good job, if we're not going to believe it when he says we did a lousy job. But when a coach gets whacked, and then says I did a good job, I'm gonna take it as a compliment!

[JRutledge]

Originally posted by rainmaker
Coach was yelling at me about a call, and ended up with, "...Judas Priest!!" I whacked him. I don't regret the call, but now I am wondering if this phrase would be considered profanity?

I think that depends on what religious conviction you hold.

Peace

[ChuckElias]

I wouldn't say it's profanity (it's right up there with "doggonit"). But clearly it is objecting to the official's decision in a manner that is unsportsmanlike. Especially if it was loud enough for the whole gym to hear, trying to show up the official.

Chuck

[Dan_ref]

Originally posted by rainmaker
Coach was yelling at me about a call, and ended up with, "...Judas Priest!!" I whacked him. I don't regret the call, but now I am wondering if this phrase would be considered profanity?

If you consider it profane then it is profanity. Everyone
has their limits, it's good that you know yours. And
soon enough the coaches in your area will know it too.

[rainmaker]

Originally posted by ChuckElias
I wouldn't say it's profanity (it's right up there with "doggonit").
Chuck

I don't know... "doggonit" has a soft sort of twang that doesn't feel quite so hostile. "Judas Priest" is so much more explosive and is more clearly an attempt to show up the ref, don'cha think?

[Mark Padgett]

Juulie - I'm sure we can all agree that there are some words that are clearly profane when said during a basketball game and deserve a T if you hear them in any context.

There are others, some of them religious references, that may not be, by themselves, considered profanity, but depending on the context, could warrant a T.

Of course, any word used in certain contexts, can and should result in a T. For instance, "stupid" isn't profanity, but if a coach calls you "stupid", you ring him up.

Of course, I'm just reasoning all this not from experience, since I never have had anyone use profanity in any of my games and I have never issued a T.

Yeah....and some pigs just flew past my window.

[rainmaker]

Mark -- Yes, I understand, I just get this sort of creepy feeling from those words, like I do when I hear a coach say the words these are meant to replace. It's the attitude behind it that's bad.

The interesting thing about this incident is that I broke the basic rule about talking to this coach after I gave the T. He asked, "What did I do to get a T?" I said, "Coach, if you're in control of your self, you know what you said. If you're not in control, you'd better give yourself a little break." He said, "Oh, I know what I said..." I interrupted, "Good, then we understand each other." Somehow, this worked. He was polite and respectful the rest of the game, and as I said before, told me I did a good job.

I felt in control of the game, and of myself, and the T made the game better, and it just worked. Hmm... Now if I can just carry this skill through until next Feb 15...

[JRutledge]

Originally posted by Mark Padgett
Juulie - I'm sure we can all agree that there are some words that are clearly profane when said during a basketball game and deserve a T if you hear them in any context.

Mark, I do not necessarily think we would all agree. I think it depends greatly on where you are, where you officiate and the type of schools involved. I guarantee you if you are doing games in the city and urban areas, you might have a different expectation for what is profane or what you allow coaches and sometimes players to get away with. If you are in the suburbs, you might have a different standard. At least officials that work in those different areas expect different things to be said and handled differently. I think is just comes down to what you are. No different than how you might call a "carry" for example.

Peace

[ChuckElias]

Originally posted by JRutledge

Mark, I do not necessarily think we would all agree. I think it depends greatly on where you are, where you officiate

Jeff, does that mean if a kid of coach yelled the "F-bomb" for the whole gym to hear, you would not think that is "clearly profane"?

Chuck

[Camron Rust]

Originally posted by JRutledge

Mark, I do not necessarily think we would all agree. I think it depends greatly on where you are, where you officiate and the type of schools involved. I guarantee you if you are doing games in the city and urban areas, you might have a different expectation for what is profane or what you allow coaches and sometimes players to get away with. If you are in the suburbs, you might have a different standard. At least officials that work in those different areas expect different things to be said and handled differently. I think is just comes down to what you are. No different than how you might call a "carry" for example.

Peace

Are you suggesting that the inner city/urban kids are not capable of controling their emotions? I hear F***, it is a T. No ifs, ands, or buts. Context or volume do not matter. I have no lessor of a standard for behavior for kids in the city than those in the suburbs. I think they are all capable of proper behavior if they are held to a high standard.

[Dan_ref]

Originally posted by rainmaker
Mark -- Yes, I understand, I just get this sort of creepy feeling from those words, like I do when I hear a coach say the words these are meant to replace. It's the attitude behind it that's bad.

The interesting thing about this incident is that I broke the basic rule about talking to this coach after I gave the T. He asked, "What did I do to get a T?" I said, "Coach, if you're in control of your self, you know what you said. If you're not in control, you'd better give yourself a little break." He said, "Oh, I know what I said..." I interrupted, "Good, then we understand each other." Somehow, this worked. He was polite and respectful the rest of the game, and as I said before, told me I did a good job.

I felt in control of the game, and of myself, and the T made the game better, and it just worked. Hmm... Now if I can just carry this skill through until next Feb 15...

Juulie, as I said this is obviously your limit. It felt
good, the coach knew it felt good, it IMPROVED THE GAME.
You done good.

[Dan_ref]

Originally posted by JRutledge

Mark, I do not necessarily think we would all agree. I think it depends greatly on where you are, where you officiate and the type of schools involved. I guarantee you if you are doing games in the city and urban areas, you might have a different expectation for what is profane or what you allow coaches and sometimes players to get away with. If you are in the suburbs, you might have a different standard. At least officials that work in those different areas expect different things to be said and handled differently. I think is just comes down to what you are. No different than how you might call a "carry" for example.

Peace

Bullsh1t.

[Oz Referee]

One thing I have noticed since contributing to this board is that American Referees (generally) are far stricter on language than the referees I officiate with. And to be honest, what I know of American society in general - I think this would probably be reflected by society as a whole (ie Aussie's swear more than Yanks).

On the basketball court, most referee's I know will put up with profanity (even the F word) if it used under certain circumstances - for example if a player is injured and in pain, or if it is used to express disgust at oneself for making a mistake. In these cases the referees that I ref with will either ignore it, or say something along the lines of "watch the language". Also, any player or coach yelling Jesus Christ, goddamn or any other religous/cultural "profanity" would almost definitely escape unscathed.

I'm not trying to say Australia is better - simply highlighting a difference. It would be interesting to see how American referees would handle refereeing "down under" and vice-versa.....

[ChuckElias]

Originally posted by Oz Referee
what I know of American society in general - I think this would probably be reflected by society as a whole (ie Aussie's swear more than Yanks).

My understanding is that this difference is reflected in more than just tolerance for "coarse" language. I've heard and read that sexual mores in Australia are much more relaxed than in the US. (Do you remember Nicole Kidman on the Letterman show when she said "crack a fat" and nobody knew what she was talking about till later?) Would you say that's true Oz, or is it just a case of the grass being greener on the other side of the ocean?

Chuck

[rainmaker]

Originally posted by Oz Referee
It would be interesting to see how American referees would handle refereeing "down under" and vice-versa.....

I admit it, I'm an uptight 'Murcan. The Aussie dentist I would need to see regularly to deal with my teeth grinding, would profit greatly if I had to ref down under...