Major upset in women's tourney
 

Jeff, I'm not saying this to start an argument, and I'm not even going to try to talk you into having any interest in women's ball. You can dislike it as much as you want to. But you did say that there aren't as many upsets in women's ball as in men's, so I just need to point out that...

Today the "Lady Vol's" (as the women's team from Tennessee is known) lost to Ball State from Muncie, Indiana. It was Ball State's first time ever in the tournament, and the first year ever that Tennessee didn't advance past the first round. I call that an upset!!

Here's a link just in case anyone's interested.

Ball State vs. Tennessee - Recap - March 22, 2009 - ESPN

Why are you qualifying your statement?
 

If people are interested, then they will respond or talk about it. I am not sure why my name is even brought up if you want to talk about an upset. But to be honest Juulie, I do not see many people talk just about upsets or games on this forum. We usually talk about plays and situations. Maybe you can point to me where anyone here is talking about the Men’s tournament outside of a call, situation or play they either want to discuss a judgment call or a rule?

Peace

I was hoping Testicle Tech would beat the Lady Vols. Jeff is right though, the women's tourney pretty much stays true to seeds. There is just a huge drop in the talent level from the eliets to the really goods and so on.

Huh? Really?!?
Have you taken a look at the men's bracket. Every single 1,2, and 3 seed advanced to the sweet sixteen. Looks very top heavy to me on the men's side.

Actually last year was the first time that all #1 seeds made the Final Four since there has been the current seeding format. Usually 2 or 3 of the top seeds get knocked off. #2 seeds often get beat in the second or third rounds. Seeds #5 and #7 have historically not made it out of the first round in the men's tournament. And #2 seeds have been beaten in the first round in previous years. I would not suggest that it is always top heavy on the men's side. Of course many teams that are higher seeds are going to advance, but it not uncommon for them to get beat early either. I do not think the same can be said for the women's tournament and multiple teams have gone undefeated the entire year. That has not happen on the Men's side since the old UCLA teams with Wooden as the coach.

Peace

Selective memory?

How many comments have been made about the game in this thread?

Did you post to talk about the game (which must be defended at all costs) or did you comment to make comments to me? Or is the just another example of my overall point I made in the first response?
:)

You said you had no idea why your name was brought up regarding upsets. Having read your previous, um, discussion, it was obvious, to most, why your name was brought up. Just trying to help. For the record, I heartily agree that anyone attempting to put the women's game anywhere close to equal footing with the men has a lot of work to do.

I have no idea (and I was not upset or shocked when saying this), because if you want to talk about a game in any tournament, you should not bring up another issue and then get upset what that issue is the focus of your thread.

This is thread #9 and still no real talk about the game yet. There have been several men's tournament threads today. In each thread comments only about the games and the calls made in those games. I wonder when that will happen in this thread.

Maybe this is just another example of what I was saying earlier.

Peace

I hope that when the Ball State campus media covers the story, there is another Brian Collins. :)

Also, word to the Cardinals. Good job ladies!

Wow, huge upset, I wasn't aware until you brought it up Juulie!

Yep, certainly fewer upsets in the women's tourney over the years than the men's and this must rank right up there with the biggest ever!

Wonder if ole Pat Summit is out of shock yet! :eek:

PS - I'll follow the tourney for two reasons:

One, to see how the Lady Terps do, and
Two, to see how that gal from Oklahoma who put her scholarship on the line does and what happens if they don't win it all......

PSS - Ya think Geno Auriemma called to offer his sympathy?

What a great shot in the arm for their program. I get a little tired of seeing Summit's mug scowling on the sideline every year.

This will get a mention from alumnus David Letterman I'm sure.

I'm pulling for our local team, Depaul, with mostly Chicago area ladies that I either saw or reffed many of their high school games.

I went to school at Tennessee (grad school) and I root for both the men's and women's teams to do well. I watched about half of the game last night and she was disappointed, but gracious in defeat. She even did an interview with ESPN right afterwards on the court.

Pat had a rough year. She had (and played) SEVEN freshmen coming off 2 consecutive national championships. I'd watch out for this team in the next couple of years.

I watch out for the Tenn Lady Vols every yr!

Wrong again. Try Indiana in 1976 being the last undefeated team and they went undefeated the previous year until the tourney.
Upsets in Women's Tourney:
7 ND 71
10 MINN 79

5 TENN 55
12 BALL 71

#11 MSU 71
#6 TEX 63

7 DEP 70
10 SDSU 76

5 XAV 59
12 GONZ 74

I should have taken my buddy's bet on this. He said he'd give me $100 bucks for each round further from the championship game Tennessee gets knocked out, with noone paying out if they lost the championship game. I would have had to pay him $500 if they won it all. This first round loss would have won $500 for me. I should have taken him on it because I knew Tenn wouldn't make it all the way! *smacking myself in the head till I bleed*

Wow, you got me by a few years. Wooden teams went undefeated in 72 and 73. :rolleyes:

And the point being made is upsets happen every year in the Men's tournament. This is the first year ever that high seeds in multiple regions made it to the Sweet 16. All but one region has the 1, 2, 3 and 4 seeds advance. The other region had a 5 beat a 4 seed. That happens almost every year in women’s basketball or the final for has mostly top seeds. Not very common that a team not expected to make the Final Four or from a mid-major conference makes it to the Final Four or Regional Championship. If UConn wins the NC this year, it will be the 4th time in recent history that an undefeated team wins the NC. That has not come close to happening in over 30 years on the Men's side. And it never happened in the current seeding structure. When Wooden was doing it, they did not have to beat teams from other regions to make the Final Four.

Once again, very little talk about the actual games or plays, just a debate about relevance. If you have to talk about relevance and not the game, that proves the point I been making all along. And if you do not want people to comment in that way, just post a thread about the game and leave it at that.

Peace

Thanks to my Boilermakers!!!!

Stupid Boilermakers!

This is a huge upset in the Women's game. Good for Ball State. And Tenn will be back next year, I'm sure.

Rutledge - just quit reading any of the threads on Women's basketball. Every time someone posts something you have to turn it into your argument about relevance. Then you keep bringing the thread back to your argument aboaut relevance. If it isn't relevant to you, shut the he!! up and let others discuss it if they want to.

Again - congrats to Ball State.

Juulie has been getting huffy and puffy over this topic for years. She got upset when it was discussed on the chat room that was developed for the tournament the last couple of years. She went out of her way to claim that she was not excited about the Men's tournament but the Women's tournament was what she was excited about (and no one asked about what we thought). And she claimed one of the reasons she left was because people put down women's or girl's basketball. If you do not want what you perceive negative comments, then do not bring up people's names and do not comment in a place you claim is hostile to your opinion. If you have not noticed, I will say what I want and do not care what others feel about those comments. And if I do not feel like talking about something, I do not bring it up. See how easy that is to do? ;)

Peace

To be fair, the OP is the one that brought Jeff into this thread. Something tells me he wouldn't have posted at all otherwise.

I'm surprised he opened the thread in the first place. Otherwise he wouldn't have seen his name. :p

Right.

It would have likely been the only time I would have seen the news on the upset. I was kind of hoping that UConn got beat.

Peace

OK, in that case I apologize Jeff. I didn't realize that you were drug into this kicking and screaming. What I get for not reading the entire thread first.

For the life of me, I just can't remember the second verse to Kumbya...

But I do feel all warm and squishy inside with all the love being thrown around.

:D

Someone does not have to be dragged to do anything. But if you start off by complaining, then do not get mad when someone addresses your complaint. ;)

Peace

That's the seafood you had last night.

I just went out of my way to say that the beginning of the men's tournament wasn't the high point of the year. Women's basketball wasn't the only issue I raised, btw. Mostly I was just trying to razz Nevada a little.

I mostly don't get huffy and puffy about people disliking women's ball. I do get way past frustrated when that dislike turns into belittling women and girls. Which you never did, Jeff, btw, but others did.

Also, I'm perfectly willing to disagree about which is more difficult to ref, women's or men's, but in the past it's always ended up with mud-slinging and flaming and I didn't just go away from that, but tried to defend myself. That was my mistake, and I left when I realized that there was going to be no way I could change the culture or tenor of this board to actively omit that stuff.

There were plenty of put downs of women's or girl's basketball, but that wasn't the reason I left, but I"m not going to go into that here. It's just not a constructive topic.

I was simply responding to your comment that there weren't upsets in the women's tournament. I was simply pointing out that while you may or may not be right overall, here was a big upset that happened very, very shortly after your comment. Just kinda interesting.

I certainly don't mind you expressing your opinions. But it IS frustrating when you claim to be dragged into something that actually, you started. Just saying...

OK. I was only referencing things you had said. I am sure there was more to the situation than what you said. I do tend to understand context. ;) And it is certainly true that the comments were not just from me.


I would understand if I said, "There never…ever is ever an upset in women's basketball." That is the farthest thing from what I have said. I said that there is not the same level of upsets as compared to the Men's side. And without getting into much detail, the information is out there. And I have won a few pools simply by picking mostly the top seeds and winning. Last year was the first time in Men's Tourney history that all top seeds made the Final Four. It is not unusual that the Men's top seeds may not make the Final Four. That was really the point I was making. That has nothing to do with putting down Women's basketball. That is stating things they talk about on ESPN all the time.

Juulie, I did not start the thread, you did. I did not come here saying "See I was right." And if you did not mention my name, I would not have said a word. And after this thread is over, I likely will not comment again until maybe the Final Four, which I sometimes watch because nothing else is going on (I am not a big early season baseball fan).

Actually there were - #7 Rutgers beat #2 Auburn.
The Gonzaga(12)/Pitt (4) game was very good and competitive and so was the Ohio St.(3)/Miss. St. (11) game even though the higher seeds moved on.
I enjoy women's basketball, I work on the women's side and being a girl myself, I have more interest than most here, but I do agree that usually there are not many upsets and even during the regular season there is a HUGE disparity between the #1 team in the country and the #10. That being said, this years tournament has been fun to watch with many more close games and even some upsets.

I was asking facetiously. I was forced :) to watch NCAA-W last night as I worked out on the eliptical. North Carolina and Florida State were also upset.

I figured you were, but maybe someone really wanted to know...:rolleyes:

The hits they just a keep a comin!
 

And, down goes Duke (1) and down goes Auburn (2) ........

No coincidence
 

I don't find it surprising that the only #1 and #2 teams to lose did so on their opponent's home courts.

"PISCATAWAY, N.J. -- Rutgers used its home-court advantage to run second-seeded Auburn right out of the NCAA tournament."

"Duke insisted it wasn't unfair, as a top-seeded team, to play on Michigan State's home court."

Well, that's the public statement. They pretty much have to say that. However, anyone with any brains at all has to admit that it is simply wrong for the lower-seed to be playing on its home court.

The reality is that until the women's side can generate enough fan support and thus money at a neutral site in the early rounds, they will continue to use home sites of teams playing in the tournament and, unlike on the men's side, will continue to allow the host teams to play there.

I believe that it is grossly unfair. :(

What else?
 

What the Wizards weren't on? Or, not interested in the WBC?:p
PS - the women of Austin Peay went down to defeat also although it wasn't an upset.:(

"The women of Austin Peay..."

Reminds me of a prim and proper lady I worked with in my youth, who would do the following cheer (and reduce herself to giggles):

"We're the girls of Norfolk U.,
We don't smoke and we don't chew!
Norfolk U.!
Norfolk U.!"

The women's tournament follows the same format as the volleyball tournament. The first two rounds are played at pre-determined home campuses, which are determined before teams are even chosen for the tournament. Some of these end up truly being neutral sites, while some, the pre-determined host school ends up playing at home (economics driving this). An example of a pre-determined site that the host school didn't even make the tournament: Texas Tech in Lubbock, Texas. There are probably a couple of others, but without looking at the brackets, I couldn't tell you what they are. The only reason I know about the TTU situation is because I've been keeping my eyes on South Dakota State (have some friends in Sioux Falls who were jumping for joy about them) and they were the only non-Texas school in the Lubbock group, and a mention was made that hopefully the Tech supporters who had tickets would get behind SDSU.

...Also carrying Jewel's banner.

"People will embrace women's college hoops if the idiots would just give us a chance. " - by Jason Whitlock

FOX Sports on MSN - Women's NCAA - Give the women a chance to succeed