Correctable error was my fault

[Scrapper1]

D3 game last night. A1 drives to the basket and is fouled hard by B1. B1 attempts to play the ball, but after the initial contact, he follows through and pulls A1 to the floor. Intentional foul. I stayed in the area to make sure nothing else flares up, A1's teammates help him up from the floor, and I go to the table to report the foul.

Both free throws are successful and I indicate to my partner that the throw-in is on the endline. He walks to me and says "Was he the right shooter?"



Fact is, I never verbalized the shooter's number at the spot of the foul, and when he asked me, I had no idea who the shooter was. My third partner confirmed that it was the wrong shooter.

We corrected it properly, the correct shooter also made both free throws, so the error made no impact on the game. But I felt, and feel, like crap. First time I neglect to say who my shooter is, and I freakin' screw the pooch.

As playoffs approach, DO NOT LET THIS HAPPEN TO YOU!!! Verbalize your shooter. What's the saying? If you can't be a good example, you'll just have to be a terrible warning.

Well, today, I'm the terrible warning. (And I'm pissed off about it! )

[Raymond]

Happens to the best of them. They had a CE in the MSU/UNC Final Four game in 2005.

At least your crew caught it immediately.

[M&M Guy]

How do both your partners know it was the wrong shooter, let two FT's happen, and THEN let you know? Why were the non-calling officials not saying, "I've got your shooter"?

Why did the player who got knocked to the floor and helped up let someone else shoot his FT's? If I got a bruise from a hard foul, I damn well will be making sure I'm shooting my FT's.

Yea, I know you feel bad about having a CE situation, but I don't think you can take all the blame for that one. Where were you partners before the FT's were shot? Also, since the player that got taken to the floor wasn't the one that shot the FT's, I would be looking seriously at team purposely putting the wrong player up there to shoot. After all, if I get taken down like that, I'm going to make sure I'm at the line, and questioning why I wasn't if one of my teammates was shooting.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by M&M Guy

After all, if I get taken down like that, I'm going to make sure I'm at the line, and questioning why I wasn't if one of my teammates was shooting.

My guess is that the team thought it was a T (or treated the same as a T) since no one was on the lane. Whoever "normally" shoots the Ts for that team went to the line.

[M&M Guy]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

My guess is that the team thought it was a T (or treated the same as a T) since no one was on the lane. Whoever "normally" shoots the Ts for that team went to the line.

Hmm, good point.

But, again, where were his partners?

[JugglingReferee]

Originally Posted by M&M Guy

Hmm, good point.

But, again, where were his partners?

Agreed! I wanna know too.

Also, I was taught (Fed, not NCAA) to grab the number of the shooter for your partner. Because I officiate football, I have developed a certain skill for remembering numbers, I have now worked into my game to grab both the foulee and fouler.

In most cases, I even have time to listen what my P reports while watching the players. (Again, something from fb: we're taught that penalty application is a *crew* responsibility; so no matter what position I work, I confirm the penalty app in my head.) It's not hard to do, and it saves us an average of 3-4 times per season (P reported a wrong number or forgot).

[fullor30]

Originally Posted by JugglingReferee

Agreed! I wanna know too.

Also, I was taught (Fed, not NCAA) to grab the number of the shooter for your partner. Because I officiate football, I have developed a certain skill for remembering numbers, I have now worked into my game to grab both the foulee and fouler.

In most cases, I even have time to listen what my P reports while watching the players. (Again, something from fb: we're taught that penalty application is a *crew* responsibility; so no matter what position I work, I confirm the penalty app in my head.) It's not hard to do, and it saves us an average of 3-4 times per season (P reported a wrong number or forgot).

It's a weakness of mine, more of reporting wrong number for foul. I find I'm easily distracted if something out of the ordinary happens which is the case in your sitch. We have Comcast game of the week here for high school and a recent game I watched a downstate official shoo the correct shooter off the line and put the wrong one up there. The proper shooter protested and was told to vamoose, other partners said nothing.

Obviously you're a good official to have risen to the college ranks, that's why you feel upset over the error. File it away, I'll bet you never let it happen again.

[JugglingReferee]

Originally Posted by fullor30

It's a weakness of mine, more of reporting wrong number for foul. I find I'm easily distracted if something out of the ordinary happens which is the case in your sitch. We have Comcast game of the week here for high school and a recent game I watched a downstate official shoo the correct shooter off the line and put the wrong one up there. The proper shooter protested and was told to vamoose, other partners said nothing.

Obviously you're a good official to have risen to the college ranks, that's why you feel upset over the error. File it away, I'll bet you never let it happen again.

You must have meant to quote Scrapper1 and not me!

[IREFU2]

Originally Posted by M&M Guy

Hmm, good point.

But, again, where were his partners?

I would like to know that as well. Thats why when I am the of official, I do my best to help my partner(s) with putting the right shooter on the line. I also try to call out my shooter after the foul....use that situation as a learning tool.

[Rita C]

Originally Posted by Scrapper1

D3 game last night. A1 drives to the basket and is fouled hard by B1. B1 attempts to play the ball, but after the initial contact, he follows through and pulls A1 to the floor. Intentional foul. I stayed in the area to make sure nothing else flares up, A1's teammates help him up from the floor, and I go to the table to report the foul.

Both free throws are successful and I indicate to my partner that the throw-in is on the endline. He walks to me and says "Was he the right shooter?"



Fact is, I never verbalized the shooter's number at the spot of the foul, and when he asked me, I had no idea who the shooter was. My third partner confirmed that it was the wrong shooter.

We corrected it properly, the correct shooter also made both free throws, so the error made no impact on the game. But I felt, and feel, like crap. First time I neglect to say who my shooter is, and I freakin' screw the pooch.

As playoffs approach, DO NOT LET THIS HAPPEN TO YOU!!! Verbalize your shooter. What's the saying? If you can't be a good example, you'll just have to be a terrible warning.

Well, today, I'm the terrible warning. (And I'm pissed off about it! )

What is some of the verbiage you all use to say the number of the shooter? I have a problem with loosing the number of the fouler if I say the number of the shooter.

Rita

[M&M Guy]

Originally Posted by Rita C

What is some of the verbiage you all use to say the number of the shooter? I have a problem with loosing the number of the fouler if I say the number of the shooter.

Rita

That should be the responsibility of your partner(s). If it was me, I would verbalize, "I've got your shooter, Rita", and even point at the player. If there was any confusion as to who the shooter might be on a foul I called, I would point at the player and tell my partner, "Here's my shooter". I would then hope my partner(s) would keep track of that player.

I usually have the same problem of keeping track of more than one number at a time when reporting a foul. That's why I try not to verbalize the shooter's number, how many fouls they have, how many TO's the team has left...er...never mind.

[KJUmp]

Originally Posted by M&M Guy

That should be the responsibility of your partner(s). If it was me, I would verbalize, "I've got your shooter, Rita", and even point at the player. If there was any confusion as to who the shooter might be on a foul I called, I would point at the player and tell my partner, "Here's my shooter". I would then hope my partner(s) would keep track of that player.

I usually have the same problem of keeping track of more than one number at a time when reporting a foul. That's why I try not to verbalize the shooter's number, how many fouls they have, how many TO's the team has left...er...never mind.

Rita...great question to ask (as I have the same problem)..M&M..great reply..thanks for explaining the mechanic.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Rita C

I have a problem with loosing the number of the fouler if I say the number of the shooter.

Originally Posted by M&M Guy

I usually have the same problem of keeping track of more than one number at a time when reporting a foul. That's why I try not to verbalize the shooter's number.

Originally Posted by KJUmp

I have the same problem.

I thought that I was the only one with this problem. I will point the shooter out to my partner, especially if it's an off the ball foul, like a rebounding foul, and I will try to see what the shooter looks like, i.e., tall, dark hair, glasses, headband, etc., but I won't look at the shooter's number, and I tell this to my partner in my pregame: Off official should help identifying free throw shooter.

Maybe we can start a support group: Officials Who Have Difficulty Remembering Two Numbers. At our first meeting we can talk about calling a double foul, and keeping the colors, and numbers, straight.

[JugglingReferee]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

I thought that I was the only one with this problem. I will point the shooter out to my partner, especially if it's an off the ball foul, like a rebounding foul, and I will try to see what the shooter looks like, i.e., tall, dark hair, glasses, headband, etc., but I won't look at the shooter's number, and I tell this to my partner in my pregame: Off official should help identifying free throw shooter.

Maybe we can start a support group: Officials Who Have Difficulty Remembering Two Numbers. At our first meeting we can talk about calling a double foul, and keeping the colors, and numbers, straight.

For help in trying to remember multiple numbers, you have to use word and number association.

For example, if the DF is Blue #24, and Red #50, it should be easy, since Labatt's Blue has 24 pops in a case, and Molson does have their pop called "50" which has a red label.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by JugglingReferee

Labatt's Blue has 24 pops in a case, and Molson does have their pop called "50" which has a red label.

That's great for you Canucks. Most of us drink Budweiser, Miller, of Coors, down here, except for me. I've got to be the only person in the USA that still drinks Schaefer.

"Schaefer, is the, one beer to have, when you're having more than one."