The Official Forum

The Official Forum (https://forum.officiating.com/)
-   Basketball (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/)
-   -   BC Violation (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/51108-bc-violation.html)

Refsmitty Thu Jan 22, 2009 08:43am

BC Violation
 
Situation:

Player A1 in FC takes a shot - team mates and defense tip ball and A2 taps the ball back towards point guard - ball goes into BC - Is this a BC violation since player control ceases on the shot?

What if the shot was such a brick that it hit the rim and bounced into the BC with no one touching until it got to BC?:confused:

CMHCoachNRef Thu Jan 22, 2009 08:45am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Refsmitty (Post 571063)
Situation:

Player A1 in FC takes a shot - team mates and defense tip ball and A2 taps the ball back towards point guard - ball goes into BC - Is this a BC violation since player control ceases on the shot?

What if the shot was such a brick that it hit the rim and bounced into the BC with no one touching until it got to BC?:confused:

Team control ends on the shot -- we don't evaluate quality, in this case. Therefore, until team control is established in the front court, again, there can be no back court violation.

jdw3018 Thu Jan 22, 2009 09:01am

The first thing you have to determine is if, after the try, any player from Team A had player control in the front court. If it's really just tapping the ball, then you can't have backcourt.

I had an example last night, however, of a player who jumped for a rebound, controlled the ball with one hand and attempted to pass it to a guard. The ball was high, went into the backcourt, and T got the BC violation correct.

The key was that control was established. Once you've determined that, then you have to apply the last to touch in the FC, first to touch after the ball has gone BC principle.

But, again, if player control is never established after a try (of any kind - one that hits the rim, hits the board, is an air ball - none of that matters) then you can't have a BC violation.

M&M Guy Thu Jan 22, 2009 11:29am

Quote:

Originally Posted by jdw3018 (Post 571074)
The first thing you have to determine is if, after the try, any player from Team A had player control in the front court. If it's really just tapping the ball, then you can't have backcourt.

I had an example last night, however, of a player who jumped for a rebound, controlled the ball with one hand and attempted to pass it to a guard. The ball was high, went into the backcourt, and T got the BC violation correct.

Just so I understand, in your situation last night, did the player actually <B>hold</B> the ball with one hand before attempting the pass?

The reason I ask is because the definition of "player control" is pretty simple (4-12-1): "A player is in control when he/she is <B>holding or dribbling</B> a live ball inbounds." If the rebound was, for example, "re-directed" towards the guard, even though the intent was there to "re-direct", that is not necessarily considered player control by definition.

Of course, if it was clear the player caught the ball with that one hand, then passed it, then yes, your T got the call correct. :)

SamIAm Thu Jan 22, 2009 12:14pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by CMHCoachNRef (Post 571064)
Team control ends on the shot -- we don't evaluate quality, in this case. Therefore, until team control is established in the front court, again, there can be no back court violation.

A slight change in your wording for more accuracy.

Therefore, until team control is established again, there can be no back court violation.

CMHCoachNRef Thu Jan 22, 2009 12:18pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by SamIAm (Post 571206)
A slight change in your wording for more accuracy.

Therefore, until team control is established again, there can be no back court violation.

Stupid comma..........:(

stosh Thu Jan 22, 2009 12:29pm

On the same subject, A1 dribbling the ball in FC has the ball slapped away by B1 and the ball goes into BC. When does the 10 second count start? We've had some discussion on this and I say that it starts as soon as the ball hits in the BC.

mbyron Thu Jan 22, 2009 01:00pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by stosh (Post 571217)
On the same subject, A1 dribbling the ball in FC has the ball slapped away by B1 and the ball goes into BC. When does the 10 second count start? We've had some discussion on this and I say that it starts as soon as the ball hits in the BC.

If the team is inbounding the ball from the endline, when do you start the count?

What exactly is the count limiting?

Adam Thu Jan 22, 2009 01:53pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by mbyron (Post 571235)
If the team is inbounding the ball from the endline, when do you start the count?

What exactly is the count limiting?

On a throwin, the count starts when team control has been established. In this situation, team control is never lost. Stosh is right, start as soon as the ball gains bc status.

mbyron Thu Jan 22, 2009 02:03pm

I wasn't following the thread and didn't know that one team had team-control. Carry on. :o

jdw3018 Thu Jan 22, 2009 02:03pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by M&M Guy (Post 571171)
Of course, if it was clear the player caught the ball with that one hand, then passed it, then yes, your T got the call correct. :)

That's exactly what happened. While in the air, A1 caught the ball with one hand, and attempted a pass out to a guard. Overthrow ended up in the backcourt where A2 recovered, hence the violation.

mick Thu Jan 22, 2009 04:25pm

Point of order [A touch off topic]
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Refsmitty (Post 571063)
What if the shot was such a brick that it hit the rim and bounced into the BC with no one touching until it got to BC?:confused:

Anyone please define the *Brick*.

I thought a *brick* was a ball that missed badly or did not bounce off the rim well. I dunno.
Thanks.

Adam Thu Jan 22, 2009 04:27pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by mick (Post 571340)
Anyone please define the *Brick*.

I thought a *brick* was a ball that missed badly or did not bounce off the rim well. I dunno.
Thanks.

To me, a brick is a low-arc shot that hits hard on the rim without really coming close to going in.

APG Thu Jan 22, 2009 05:12pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by stosh (Post 571217)
On the same subject, A1 dribbling the ball in FC has the ball slapped away by B1 and the ball goes into BC. When does the 10 second count start? We've had some discussion on this and I say that it starts as soon as the ball hits in the BC.

From the 08-09 NFHS Interpretations:


SITUATION 8: A1 is dribbling in his/her frontcourt when B1 deflects the ball into A's backcourt. The ball is bouncing toward the end line in A's backcourt while A1 and B1 give chase. B1 and A1 each contact the ball, but neither gains control. Finally, after numerous attempts by each player, A1 gains possession deep in A's backcourt. When does the 10-second count begin anew for Team A? RULING: The count starts as soon as the ball goes into the backcourt since team control has not ended. (4-12-3; 9-8)

M&M Guy Thu Jan 22, 2009 06:08pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 571342)
To me, a brick is a low-arc shot that hits hard on the rim without really coming close to going in.

Simply check out the 10,785 YouTube videos of Shaq attempting FT's.


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:43am.



Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.3.0 RC1