You make the call - newbies especially invited to participate
 

This happened in my game last night. A1 in backcourt with the ball. He passes to A2 who is facing him, standing on the division line with part of both shoes in the backcourt, part on the line and part in the frontcourt (he had big feet, OK?). A2 catches the ball and, without moving his feet, passes the ball back to A1 who is still in the backcourt.

Is this a violation?

no

Were all three points in the frontcourt? there is your answer.

Yes, when A2 caught the ball Mark was on 8 of his b/c count & when A1 received the pass back Mark was well past 10 seconds... {tweet} 10 b/c violation.

all 3 points were also in the backcourt.

No violation 4-35-2

Did either of them hit the ball with her pigtails?

No.

Not to digress too much, but now what if Mr. Big Feet catches the pass and starts dribbling parallel to the division line, feet in the forecourt, ball bouncing up and down in the backcourt/on the line? (Almost kind of reminds of the old one: Can you tell me if my turn signal is working? OK -- yes, no, yes, no ...)

all 3 points have to be frontcourt -- the player can still go to the backcourt and it not be a violation since the ball never made it to the front court with the player.

Using the 3-point thingy as a guideline is confusing. That rule only applies on a dribble from the bc to the fc, and in no way is applicable to this sitch. The question is, does the ball have fc status or bc status when A2 catches it? Since A2 has bc status, so does the ball. End of discussion.

Julie,

I was responding to the post that was right before mine. See Amesman's previous post.

Okay, I see. but you responded wrong. If he catches ball with his feet in the fc, and then dribbles in the bc, it's a violation, right? What am I missing?

Juulie - did you get my email yesterday? If not, that would be lame. (inside joke, guys) ;)

Ed McMahon: And how big were they? :p

I would say it isn't a BC violation as he still has the right to be in the BC since both of his feet still obtain some of the backcourt floor. I'm thinking of this in terms of what if he started dribbling and moved into the BC and thus removed his big feed from the division line. I would not call a violation then, so I would not call a violation if he passed the ball back without dribbling.

Is there a trick answer to this? Because it seems like there might be...

Yea. I got it. Yup, lame!

No trick.
 

You're right. I would suggest he is IN the backcourt. Period.

Julie,

he added to the stitch that what if the same player then began to dribble but both his feet ended up in the FC and the ball remained in the BC.

Preety much what I was getting at. Three points applies to dribbling, but it you catch the ball with both feet in the front court, the third point ( the ball) now has front court status. Still three points.

I dont get what you are saying -- because the feet were NOT in the frontcourt.

To clarify my question a bit here, we have the same sitch as Mark posed in the OP (ball caught with feet on division line) and dribble starts.

BUT then player dribbles parallel to division line -- feet in forecourt but ball bouncing in back court. Does he establish himself in forecourt when the ball leaves the backcourt floor on a dribble? Or is he still backcourt until the ball is actually bounced in the forecourt?

What if he's dribbling like that and simply picks up his dribble -- still never having had it land in the forecourt -- does that change your answer?

Suppose player catches ball with a foot in BC and begins to dribble. Now the "3-point" part of the rule goes in to effect: he's a dribbler in the BC, so both feet and the ball must be in FC for him to have FC status.

Put the point differently: if a player catches the ball, then the ball has the same status as the player (BC in your question). The ball can gain FC status without a dribble, if, for instance, a player is straddling the line and pivots into the FC (even just picking up the BC foot would do it). If a player with BC status begins to dribble with the ball or either foot in the BC, the ball still has BC status.

Keep the 10-second BC count going during all of the action you describe.

If his feet are on the division line when he starts dribbling, then the 3 point guideline is in play. If his feet were in the FC when he caught the ball, 3 points do not matter.

Now, let's say he starts dribbling with his feet on the line and the ball bouncing in the BC. While dribbling, he moves his feet to the FC but the ball continues bouncing in the BC. Once he picks up his dribble, he has ended the three points issue, and now has FC status.

Ah, I see now. I didn't realize you were saying that he caught the ball with feet on the division line as in the OP. Deecee is correct,then. Three points applies.

THAT is the scenario I was (so pathetically) trying to describe. :o Thanks

Division Line Reminder
 

The division line is in the backcourt. I know this doesn't really apply to the OP, but since b/c violations are commonly confusing, I thought it would be good to think this out before we get on the court.

I believe the answer is no. The ball and both feet never totally entered into the front court. Play continues, nothing called.

no. the rule states that the offensive player must establish himself in front court-all three points- ball, both feet, before he is in the front court. this is not a violation

Which situation are you referring to?

the op

Then the "3 points" rule is not relevant. The player in the OP is not dribbling.