My first (high school) ejection
 

What a night Saturday was.

JV girls, two really good teams and a really intense game.

Home coach is gradually starting to get on my partner’s and my nerves. He’s starting to complain about every call and starts bringing up the foul count. A few minutes left in the second quarter I finally go to the bench in response to some more of his whining and let him know “we’ve heard your concerns, coach, and now we’re done talking.”

In the second half, he starts out fine but gets riled up again a few minutes into the game. As I am lead opposite his bench, he yells out to me “You are both horrible.”

Whack!

I tell my partner to inform him that he must now wear a seatbelt for the rest of the game. My partner is a bit of a wet noodle, and he never does, so a few trips down the floor, the coach is up not doing anything, just pacing the sideline. I inform him at the next time out that, by rule, he’s lost his coaching box and he has to have a seat on the bench. He grumbles and gives me a nice stare as I walk away.

This guy is sneaky, though. Throughout the fourth quarter, I can see him as I am trail on his bench side standing in the coaching box. Three separate times, as I turn my head after I or my partner has blown the whistle, I turn my head to observe him fully and he sits down on the bench.

During a timeout, he asks to talk to me and says “I know you’ve got something against me, but don’t take it out on my players,” and walks away.

Riiiiiiiight.

I tell my partner “He’s not sitting on the bench. I’ve given him a warning. If someone’s gonna toss him, it would look a lot better if it was you.” My partner then proceeds to tell me “Well, there’s only a few minutes left and the score is close, so I think I’ll just let him be.”

So I tell him “Fine. If you’re not going to do it, then I will.” Guess I’m on my own tonight.

We get through the fourth quarter and we’re going to overtime. Before the jump ball, I go to the coach and tell him “Look, I don’t want to punish your girls. They’re playing great and they’re right in this thing. But I have already warned you about being off the bench. It’s not fair for the other team to be playing by the rules and me to allow you to blatantly ignore a rule you have been informed about. I don’t want to toss you, but if I observe you off the bench unless it’s to call a timeout or to react to your players, I’m going to have no choice but to give you another T, which will mean automatic ejection.”

His response is (supposedly) extremely contrite and “Yes, I understand, I won’t be a problem.”

Not a minute and a half into overtime, I’m trail next to his bench as his point guard drives the lane. She loses the ball and there is a scrum for the loose ball. My partner calls held ball and the coach goes nuts. He jumps off the bench with his hands waving in the air running towards me.

Whack!

Then I had to wait about a minute for him to take his sweet time getting off the court as he stared me down the whole way.

My partner said after the game he had my back and was all ready to T him up but that I just blew my whistle first.

Right.

IMO - after the first T and he was supposed to be sitting - I think you gave him too much leeway - even if he was sneaky in standing in the box after the T. If I'd have seen him do that - he would have gotten the second T quickly. He was making a mockery of the rule and the officials and therefore would have been gone. :(

Good T. The "something against me" is borderline personal, if not over. I would just chalk it up to incorrect judgment, as most coaches do when they want a foul. ;) Good one to not react to.

And I agree with you about the hesitation to believe that your P would have backed you up.

Good job.

I agree with the "something against me" comment. I would have responded to him along the lines of, "Coach I am going to let that one go so that hopefully we can work together the rest of the game. I will not be this nice, or courteous if I have to have this conversation with you again." and I would walk away. If he doesn't explicitly get what will happen next then oh well, not my problem.

I agree! With that being said, how would you handle the coaches who takes 2-3 steps out the box (toward the opposite end of the court) every time you go the other way & sneaks back in when you come his way?

Keep in mind, he's not complaining or whining just coaching and he's back in his box by the time you get there to tell him.

Yeah, I hear you and talked with the varsity refs after the game about it (after my partner left).

I was honestly waiting for my partner to do something about it. I falsely assumed that he, you know, had a spine. :rolleyes:

Once I figured out he was not going to back me up, I made the determination that the next time I was in legitimate position to get him, I would. The second T was that opportunity.

more patience than me.
 

I have to say I might have gotten him before the end of regulation, however I have to say I admire your restraint in making absolutly sure on the second T that everyone there knew it was going to happen.

I also admire your restraint in not giving you partner a foot in the backside during the game?

I hope that there was some discussion of this after the game, and in the report you filed?
Weak officials like that are why there are always points of emphasis on coaches and player behavior. If everyone would just take care of business when necessary, the coaches would understand what they can do all the time and most of this crap would be eliminated. But because some wet noodles let them get away with this stuff, everyone has to put up with it.

I was shadowing a kid during a training class earlier this year and we told the coach to go off on him. The kid kept looking at me like I needed to give him permission to call the T, (and it was personal and directed right at him), his partner finally got the coach from the other side of the floor.

Asked him what he was waiting for?
Well I have seen coaches do worse and not get a T in college!

Wow!

If he's not complaining or whining then how do you notice that he is out? :) I know what you are saying, but just to make the point that I go out of my way to not notice what the coaches are doing unless they are making themselves get noticed...the game is on the floor, worrying too much about what the coaches are doing just draws my attention away from the game...

Game awareness is more than just what's happening on the court.

I guess a dead ball would be a good time to address the sneaking in/out of the box.

A word of caution: Be careful about glorifying this call, in your own mind, or especially if describing it to others. Sounds like this coach wrote his own ticket, so nobody should have a problem with what you did. But if you refer to waiting for an "opportunity" to "get him," it could be misconstrued.

We've been told specifically that we are paid to notice these things. If the coach's behavior is distracting you from the game (and this includes moving in and out of his box), you take care of the behavior; you don't ignore it.

Well, I had a whole speech planned and some theatrics (throwing my jacket, etc) :D

But the first thing he said when he got back to the changing room* was "Oh, I was getting ready to give him that second T, but you beat me to it."

I just rolled my eyes, gave him a similar lecture about getting the job done because someone's gotta do it, and left it at that.


*So after the game, the moment the buzzer sounds, of course I'm booking it back to the locker room. I turn around as I'm almost completely off the court into the hallway and my partner is nowhere to be found!! Then I see him at the scorer’s table talking to the AD!!! :eek:

So, I run back to the locker room alone (where the head coach is waiting outside the door to berate my, by the way). I ignore him and go into the locker room and immediately the varsity refs say “Where the heck is your partner?”

I just shrug my shoulders and say “I guess he decided to have a conversation with the AD on the floor after the game.”

They couldn’t believe it either. They gave him a decent tongue lashing after the game for that.

Good point. Thanks.

What if the coach is on the floor? Are there other parts of the floor you don't pay attention to while the game is going on? Is the clock part of the game? Do you not pay attention to that since it isn't "on the floor"? Subs are usually in the same area coaches tend to wander, so do you not pay attention to subs either?

Dealing with coaches, bench personnel, table crew, and fans are all part of the game. Unfortunately, that is the very attitude that has the NFHS issuing POE's on bench decorum. The specific comment, "As long as the coach isn't bothering me, I'm not going to worry about what they're doing" was specifically addressed in the POE. And when I work with that coach the next night, I have to hear about how his spot on the floor hasn't been an issue with previous refs.

You don't have to be difficult when dealing with coaches who stray - a simple reminder the next time you're next to them should jog their memory. Maybe the next time needs a verbal warning. If both of those do not work, then they are the ones who hurt their team by not following the rules.

Is it fair to the other coach who is staying in their box and following the rules?

NCAA or HS? Around here they tell us in HS clinics to watch for these things, then when you work with the clinicians during the year they don't "ignore" it, but they are less attentive to coaches who might be a step or two out at various points in the game "coaching their teams"...I would never tell anyone to ignore it, I'm just saying that I usually don't notice it until it is directed at me...

If I wasn't sure about it and they were not complaining, no prior incidents: "Coach - the lines on the floor indicate where your coaches box is. If I see you out of that space I'm requried to enforce the rule. I know you haven't been ranting but I'll still have to enforce the rule. Please stay within the box." Next time he feels obligated to take the 2-3 steps out - I'll feel obligated to whack him - without prejudice!:D

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Was it a close ending? I just ask because you said you book/ran off the court.

I would help my partner off the court (especially if I'm the R) because if he has to T someone after the game then you might have to clock back in... wait a minute, he proved that he's not gonna T anybody :D

Like I said I could name the names of the clinicians who have said the very thing that you are saying and then when you work with them they tend to have a bit more of a lenient attitude let's say.....all I'm saying is let's be real...Fri night I worked with two boys state finals officials, the R made the statement in the pregame "Techincal fouls slow down games"...and during the game I'm sure there were instances where both coaches were a foot or three outside of the box and we never had a problem...I am not saying you are wrong, I'm sure the amount of attention paid to this type of thing is state, association and even league(assigner) specific...I am only speaking based on what I have experienced...

All foul's slow down games - what's his point?

Interesting timing....

I just got an email from the AD whining about how my two T's cost his girls the game.

I referred his comments to our commissioner without further discussion.

My pet peeve here is that I had an R box us in with this during the coach's meeting. "Coach, as long as you're coaching, we're probably not going to notice you." This guy is a varsity ref (this was a jv game) who does some college; only doing jv because he had to in order to work playoffs.

When he mentioned it to the guys coming to work Varsity, I could tell they were just as annoyed.

Let me clarify though, I don't mean to say "ignore" anybody..of course you are aware of what is going on, but what I am saying more is that I would normally not slow the game down, I might say as I am running by or inbounding "coach please mind the box", or I might walk him back to his bench...but to tech a coach that is two steps outside the box coaching his team, who has not been warned previously for something more egregious, I have never seen that in my area quite honestly...

In transition & whenever there's a whistle, in addition to watching the players on the floor I like to sneak a peek at the clock, table & benches.

Developing good game awareness has really helped me with correcting timing issues before everyone starts screaming, bringing my subs before the horn goes, granting coaches TO requests before they lose it.

His point I suppose is that T's are more of a production and slow the game down and basically don't call one! Not saying I agree with that style of "game management", if you have something that needs to be addressed you do it....

I hope you CC'd the state office, too. Is there a report you have to fill out with them on an ejection?

We fill out a report and send it to our commissioner, who sends it to the state.

The AD did tell me in his email, though, that they had already decided to pull the coach for the next game, though.

Agreed I check the table every dead ball..again of course you notice the coaches, what I said was tongue in cheek thus the :)....I notice, but don't always "notice"...there are obviously limits, a coach "coaching his team" out in front of the scorer's table is going to get dealt with much more quickly and harshly than a coach who steps out two steps when his team is at the other end of the floor and then is back in when the ball is at his end...the rule is that he is to be inside the box, so unless any of you can honestly say that you enforce this 100% (ie no toes out) to a T (no pun intended), all we are really talking about is degrees which like I said I'm sure vary depending on where you are...

This quote, or something along the lines of "Coach, your box is marked. We're not going to get too worked up over the lines unless you give us reason to," is pretty common around here.

And, quite frankly, I've got no issue with it. If a coach is coaching, and pretty much staying in his box, I'm not concerned with a step or two outside the lines. Don't get on the court when play is there, don't be in front of the scorer's table, and we don't have an issue. That's pretty much accepted in my area as long as the coach isn't on us.

However, if he wanders too much or starts to gripe, he gets a gentle warning to stay in the box and then we pay attention. If he gets whacked and is seat belted, then it's a pretty strict interpretation.

Agree completely.

And if you notice, I said the same thing you did - the 3 W's: wremind, warn, whack. :rolleyes: :D

Of course we don't throw out T's for the coach who is a step or two outside the box, especially before I've had a chance to remind them about it. And I would be curious as to the context of your partner's comment about "T's slow down the game". Can you help remind a coach to stay in the box instead of giving a T the first time? Sure. A T in that case would slow down the game. Can you help communicate with a coach and address their concerns instead of letting them vent to a point where it is hard to ignore their behavior? Sure. Sometime communication skills can help difuse a situation that would otherwise have to be addressed. But I hope they do not mean "avoid giving a T", even if the situation warrants.

I guess we know what your partner was talking to the AD about after the game.

BTW, in your report to the state (assuming you do one for ejects), I'd be sure and mention both the coach meeting you at the locker room and the AD sending you the email. I'd include the email, too.

Gee, why? If it was your fault....

Well that was sort of what I took out of it...in fact that was about the extent of his pre-game, so there is your context:D. The two of them are regular partners, so they of course were on the same page..I tried to raise a few situations just to get a feel for what I was dealing with, but I wasn't going to force the guy to do a "thorough" pre-game...game actually went great, maybe we were lucky?

But your note above about reminding a coach to stay in the box instead of a T "the first time". If you are running by and say "coach please mind the box". Would you consider that a warning as if the next time he is a step out you are going to pop him? Or would you give that same "warning" again?

I mentioned both to my commissioner, who handles sending the report to the state. He's told me multiple times that he's got my back. He's a good commish.

Maybe you were lucky. But you did the right thing in trying to open some sort of pre-game dialog.

It's usually an escalating process. The first time might be a simple reminder as you go past, "Coach help us out by staying in your box." Or, "Coach, remember what those lines are for?" as you give them a little wink. The next time might be a little louder, so more people are aware, "Coach, we need you to stay in your box." That way, the next time it is obvious as to why the T was given. Of course, depending on the situation, I might skip step 1 or 2.

I've also tossed a coach for simply coaching his team. It happened to be after his 1st T, and he had been reminded about needing to be seated. I almost ran into him as I came up the court, so it was an "easy" T. He wasn't happy about being ejected in a close game, but he didn't have a real complaint because it was obvious how the situation evolved. I'm sure the next time it happens, he will remember to stay seated. I'm sure there are officials that will give multiple reminders, in order to "avoid the T". But I'm not sure how I can expain that to the other coach who is following the rules.

Agree with you completely following the first tech, this one is pretty cut and dry. If he is up after he has already gotten the 1st there is really not much wiggle room in my opinion...and you bring up a good point, if there is one coach who is taking liberties that our crew is allowing and the other coach decides to call us on it (which I can't remember the last time this happened), then I will definitely pay closer attention and the first warning to the offending coach will likely be the only....that said the coach who decides to speak up better be minding his own p's & q's as well...but again this whole thing to me falls under game management which I don't believe there is a "right answer" to...but it is also something that I know I can always improve and am always working on...

I've seen this on the board a couple times already, and I dont know how rampant this is where others officiate, but I am yet to hear from an opposing coach about the other coach "getting away" with anything? So why would you explain to a coach who isn't asking a question?

Most of us joke, but its mostly true, that most coaches don't know the rules. Why would it be any different here? ;)

The point is, if you follow the rules, you have the best defense for the people who count - your partners and your assignor. Perhaps you get "lucky" and the other coach doesn't know the rule. But if they do, you've put yourself in an undefensible position if you allow something that is clearly written as not allowed. Why take the chance?

A good partner, even if you got to it first, would have still blown their whistle if only to emphasize the call and its correctness.

GOOD POINT!!! I use that technique also - especially during a dead ball. It's a good management tool to head off potential problems later in the game.