Travel?
 

Forgive me if this has been discussed before.

A1 has control of the ball and is falling to the floor but lands on B1 (who is on the ground) but never touches the floor. B3 creates a held ball situation by grabbing the ball.

What do we have, travel or held ball?

i dont see why we wouldnt have a travel -- why would the fact that a player is already on the ground not make it a travel?

i can already see the player control fouls coming out here -- "but the guy on the floor had LGP" :)

My thoughts as well but while discussing with another official, we looked at the rule & it says a player holding the ball may not fall to the floor . In this sitch the player fell on another player, never touching the floor.

B1 on the floor had nothing to do with A1 falling. Lets say B1 tripped over a volleyball line.

if the pivot foot didn't hit the floor again ...
nor any other part of their body except the hand or ball ever hit the floor ...?


think about it it will come to you ...

if A1 tripped on B1 and fell on him then its a blocking foul on B1, B1 does not have LGP

Not if B1 isn't moving (NFHS rules). If he's not moving, he doesn't need LGP and it can't be a block.

BTW, I do not have a travel on the original play. The floor is key here.

In NCAA you would be correct; in Fed. you may not be correct. B1 may not have LGP, but B1 is still entitled to a spot on the floor and is not automatically responsible for the contact.

D a
 

why does legal guarding position apply? :confused:

B1's position on the floor could be legal? :o

is it not A1's job to avoid contact with a defender who has a legal position on the floor? :rolleyes:

So why doesn't the intent of the rule apply here? - when do we get to be lieteral and focus on the intent of rules?

Not true.

Under NFHS rules, every player is entitled to a spot on the floor as long as he gained the spot legally.

A defender does not have to have LGP to be fouled.

so if B1 is laying under the basket and A1 goes up for a shot and lands on B1 what do you guys have?????

PC unless the ball goes in the basket prior to contact, in which case it's just an injury time out for A1 and or B1.

If A1 dives on the floor for a loose ball mishandles it and he loses it stops sliding then B2 also going for the ball trips over A1. what ya got??:confused:

who all agrees with this???

Originally Posted by jevaque View Post
so if B1 is laying under the basket and A1 goes up for a shot and lands on B1 what do you guys have?????

PC unless the ball goes in the basket prior to contact, in which case it's just an injury time out for A1 and or B1.

A MS game?

A mad scramble for the ball,
A1 was legally on the floor (got there first) wasn't moving
B tripped over A going to get the ball show me where the foul is?

Now if A1 is slidding and wipes out B2 then there is a foul on A but otherwise it is ugly but there really isn't a difinative foul here.

By rule he's got you,
there is nothing wrong with being on the floor
there is nothing wrong with being under the basket (NBA excluded)
and as long as that position was obtained before the shooter went airborne
I do not see where the issue is.

Now making the call is something altogether different - this is one of those does it fit the game calls in my opinion.
So with my luck it happens in the first 90 seconds of the game.

:D

jevaque, sounds like you're trying to grasp some of these concepts, and perhaps you don't quite agree. Do you have a rule book handy? If so, do you have any rules basis for your disagreement?

JEVAQUE -- not all contact is a foul. This is one situation where its not.

Likely a no-call.

Coach will likely think it's "something," though. Still trying to find the signal for "something."

I could agree with a no-call here as long as B1 doesn't get injured by the contact. No way it's a block, though.

You're looking for it in the wrong place - it's listed under "Giving Him The Business".

The something signal is simple -- make a fist and extend the "first, middle and ring finger" but keep them pressed together. Then just ask the coach to read between the lines. There you now have "something.".

You really need to stop reading Padgett's rule book. It's not the official version.

Well its the "official enough" version. Now his case book is the only one of a kind.

I had occasion to look up Ron Cherry's famous YouTube video of the same title in honor of his white-hatting last night.

Stupid, contrived moment. Now, the Ben Dreith one was priceless.

Seems like at the youth level, we get this sitch every other game. Defender falls down due to puberty or whatever, dribbler then drives by, over or around the fallen player and trips over him through NO action by the defender. Loses ball out of bounds and the OC comes unglued with "Come on ref, you gotta call something there!"

"OK Coach; {whack} Technical Foul on the Head Coach!"

I know I wont T for that statement alone.

"Clumsy is not a foul, coach."

Nice, short response, consider it stolen :D

Related, and works for violations too: "no rule against clumsy, coach."