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-   -   Penalty for this or not? (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/50320-penalty-not.html)

Illini_Ref Sat Dec 13, 2008 09:00am

Penalty for this or not?
 
This has been discussed somewhat in other threads.

I worked with a very good rules guy last night and we differed when discussign a hypothetical situation. Here goes.

A1 inbounding on a SPOT throw-in. B1 defending the thrower. A1 is well behind the line and releases the throw. B1 reaches through the plane after the ball is released and touches the pass (or grabs it).

I say there is no rule making this illegal. The rule speaks of a ball being passed outside the line to a teammate (not a spot throw-in) and reaching through BEFORE the ball is released. He was certain that this was a violation.

Can anyone answer with certainty?

muxbule Sat Dec 13, 2008 09:07am

9-2-10 I believe

bob jenkins Sat Dec 13, 2008 09:15am

The violation section (9-2-x -- I' maway from the books) specifically says "until the ball has been released on an inbounds pass."

Ignats75 Sat Dec 13, 2008 09:45am

9-2-10

ART. 10. . . The opponent(s) of the thrower shall not have any part of his/her
person through the inbounds side of the throw-in boundary-line plane until the
ball has been released on a throw-in pass.
NOTE: The thrower may penetrate the plane provided he/she does not touch the inbounds
area before the ball is released on the throw-in pass. The opponent in this situation may
legally touch or grasp the ball.

Toxic Czar Sat Dec 13, 2008 03:47pm

If the thrower extends his arms through the plane while holding the ball and the defender grabs the ball such that both are holding the ball, what is the proper call? Is it a held ball or is it out-of-bounds on the thrower?

Juulie Downs Sat Dec 13, 2008 04:06pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toxic Czar (Post 557897)
If the thrower extends his arms through the plane while holding the ball and the defender grabs the ball such that both are holding the ball, what is the proper call? Is it a held ball or is it out-of-bounds on the thrower?

Held ball. and the arrow (if applicable) hasn't changed, since the throw-in never ended, so it's essentially a do-over.

Illini_Ref Wed Dec 17, 2008 09:36am

So we agree that reaching through and touching a ball AFTER release on a spot throw-in is NOT a violation?

Adam Wed Dec 17, 2008 09:43am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Illini_Ref (Post 558928)
So we agree that reaching through and touching a ball AFTER release on a spot throw-in is NOT a violation?

I hope so, that's pretty clear in the rules.

Illini_Ref Wed Dec 17, 2008 09:44am

Just wanting to be clear. I had a three hour drive home last night on ice-covered roads and I'm not thinking real clear yet. ;)

Adam Wed Dec 17, 2008 09:48am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Illini_Ref (Post 558939)
Just wanting to be clear. I had a three hour drive home last night on ice-covered roads and I'm not thinking real clear yet. ;)

Ouch. I understand.

Nevadaref Wed Dec 17, 2008 09:56am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Illini_Ref (Post 558928)
So we agree that reaching through and touching a ball AFTER release on a spot throw-in is NOT a violation?

That's true for NFHS games.
The rule is different at the NCAA level. The defender must wait until the ball breaks the boundary plane.
I've posted this difference several times on this forum. If you do a search, you can locate one of the past threads.

I'm thinking that your partner also works at the NCAA level. That would explain his confusion.

Vinski Wed Dec 17, 2008 10:59am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Juulie Downs (Post 557900)
Held ball. and the arrow (if applicable) hasn't changed, since the throw-in never ended, so it's essentially a do-over.

To be clear, in this situation team A would only maintain possession if this was an AP throw-in or if A had the arrow. If this was not an AP throw-in and B had the arrow, team B would get the ball. Correct??

Adam Wed Dec 17, 2008 11:00am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vinski (Post 558982)
To be clear, in this situation team A would only maintain possession if this was an AP throw-in or if A had the arrow. If this was not an AP throw-in and B had the arrow, team B would get the ball. Correct??

Correct. It's a held ball.

tjones1 Wed Dec 17, 2008 05:01pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Illini_Ref (Post 558939)
Just wanting to be clear. I had a three hour drive home last night on ice-covered roads and I'm not thinking real clear yet. ;)

Ouch. You were one of the few who had a game last night. If I would have known, I would have rode along with you.

refnrev Wed Dec 17, 2008 05:17pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Illini_Ref (Post 558939)
Just wanting to be clear. I had a three hour drive home last night on ice-covered roads and I'm not thinking real clear yet. ;)

I take it you were not down state if you had a game last night???


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