What would you have done?

Had a boys varsity game last night at a youth detention center. There was only 1 clock, no arrow at the table & an incompetent table crew (prisoners) who started/stopped the clock whenever they could remember.

So 2:31 left in the 4th quarter, home team down by 8… they inbound the ball in their b/c (I’m new L in 2 person game facing the lone clock) then the baseball pass to the big guy right in front of me. As the baseball pass is coming to me I sneak-a-peak & notice that the clock is still at 2:31 I didn’t want to kill their opportunity to score. I hoped the clock would miraculously start (once again) as the fans/coaches of the visiting team were singing the theme song of the night “start the clock”. It didn’t start and there was a quick shot, a miss, an offensive rebound, another shot, miss, rebound & finally a score.
I hit the whistle & got intercepted by the V coach on my way to the table. He was livid, saying “I had to take some time off the clock” and he is protesting if they lose…
I tell him I don’t have definite info to do so (no counts) & that protests are not recognized by the Feds in basketball.

How could I have handled that situation better?

[CoachP]

Originally Posted by Ch1town

Had a boys varsity game last night at a youth detention center. There was only 1 clock, no arrow at the table & an incompetent table crew (prisoners) who started/stopped the clock whenever they could remember.

So 2:31 left in the 4th quarter, home team down by 8… they inbound the ball in their b/c (I’m new L in 2 person game facing the lone clock) then the baseball pass to the big guy right in front of me. As the baseball pass is coming to me I sneak-a-peak & notice that the clock is still at 2:31 I didn’t want to kill their opportunity to score. I hoped the clock would miraculously start (once again) as the fans/coaches of the visiting team were singing the theme song of the night “start the clock”. It didn’t start and there was a quick shot, a miss, an offensive rebound, another shot, miss, rebound & finally a score.
I hit the whistle & got intercepted by the V coach on my way to the table. He was livid, saying “I had to take some time off the clock” and he is protesting if they lose…
I tell him I don’t have definite info to do so (no counts) & that protests are not recognized by the Feds in basketball.

How could I have handled that situation better?

I heard an official sing "start the clock" once 2-3 years ago...on the run!

Not sure that's in your mechanics book though......

[fullor30]

I think you did the best you could do under the circumstances. You said the clock was not being started/stopped correctly the whole game, now suddenly the coach has a problem.

Since I'm from Illinois, I recommend our fine Governor when he is behind bars to be on the table since he is used to running things.

[Mark Padgett]

I would have told the coach that even thought the clock didn't start, the time still counted toward the kid's terms.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Ch1town

How could I have handled that situation better?

If you can't stop play, I'd start a count.

I didn't know they had varsity games in jails; even juvies. Wow! Were they playing another detention center, or a high school?

Originally Posted by CoachP

I heard an official sing "start the clock" once 2-3 years ago...on the run!

Not sure that's in your mechanics book though......

I was opposite tableside & it was extremely loud in there. Every prisoner attends the game, between them & their parents, the visiting teams fans, the gym is filled to the max & the prisoners sing rehearsed chants/cheers in unison throughout the contest...
That was the best part of working that game!!

Originally Posted by fullor30

I think you did the best you could do under the circumstances. You said the clock was not being started/stopped correctly the whole game, now suddenly the coach has a problem.

Since we are both from Illinois, I recommend our fine Governor when he is behind bars to be on the table since he is used to running things.

Niiice

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

If you can't stop play, I'd start a count.

I didn't know they had varsity games in jails; even juvies. Wow! Were they playing another detention center, or a high school?

Too busy with the 6'5" post players to keep a count too
Yes sir they play all sports home & away. They were playing a regular 5A HS team. Beautiful facility with a nicer sound system than most regular HS.

I had a nephew locked down there a few years back.

[mick]

Originally Posted by Ch1town

As the baseball pass is coming to me I sneak-a-peak & notice that the clock is still at 2:31

How could I have handled that situation better?

Start a count in your head if you can, but it sounds like you were pretty busy at the time.

[refguy]

Originally Posted by Ch1town

Had a boys varsity game last night at a youth detention center. There was only 1 clock, no arrow at the table & an incompetent table crew (prisoners) who started/stopped the clock whenever they could remember.

So 2:31 left in the 4th quarter, home team down by 8… they inbound the ball in their b/c (I’m new L in 2 person game facing the lone clock) then the baseball pass to the big guy right in front of me. As the baseball pass is coming to me I sneak-a-peak & notice that the clock is still at 2:31 I didn’t want to kill their opportunity to score. I hoped the clock would miraculously start (once again) as the fans/coaches of the visiting team were singing the theme song of the night “start the clock”. It didn’t start and there was a quick shot, a miss, an offensive rebound, another shot, miss, rebound & finally a score.
I hit the whistle & got intercepted by the V coach on my way to the table. He was livid, saying “I had to take some time off the clock” and he is protesting if they lose…
I tell him I don’t have definite info to do so (no counts) & that protests are not recognized by the Feds in basketball.

How could I have handled that situation better?

What do you mean you didn't have definite info?
You just stated that you DEFINITELY saw that the clock was DEFINITELY not started properly. Get together with your partner and decide how much time should be taken off.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by refguy

What do you mean you didn't have definite info?
You just stated that you DEFINITELY saw that the clock was DEFINITELY not started properly. Get together with your partner and decide how much time should be taken off.

You need more than that, you need to know how much time to take off. Without a count, you don't have that.

[tjones1]

Originally Posted by refguy

What do you mean you didn't have definite info?
You just stated that you DEFINITELY saw that the clock was DEFINITELY not started properly. Get together with your partner and decide how much time should be taken off.

Which can only be done with definite knowledge (i.e. counts).

Originally Posted by refguy

Get together with your partner and decide how much time should be taken off.

That's what the visiting coach was saying
Maybe he would've hustled me a couple seasons ago, but 5-10-1 & 2 has taught me otherwise...

Mick - You're right, that post-play was intense. Was hoping my tableside partner would sneak-a-peak & fix on his way to the f/c.

Mark - It was the regular HS coach complaining

[ronald]

Questions and a thought:

1) Did you or another official have some type of discussion with the timer about procedures for starting the clock? Seems from your post that this was an ongoing issue that the officials were not aware of or were aware of it and did not do anything proactive to rectify the clock management.

2) Sounds like a good issue for the vetererns on this board to give thoughtful guidance on how to handle a situation of this nature.

3) Is there anything specific in the rules that allows one to blow the whistle, go to the timer and tell em to start the clock when the ball is now inbounded?

4) If not a specific rule (do not remember one), how about the all encomposing one that allows the referee to make decisions not specifically addressed in the rules?

Thanks

[Adam]

Originally Posted by ronald

4) If not a specific rule (do not remember one), how about the all encomposing one that allows the referee to make decisions not specifically addressed in the rules?

Can't use that one here, becuase the situation is addressed in the rules.

[Juulie Downs]

For the next time you go there:

1) Recommend that they pay the clock operator and the book people. This way, they have some leverage in making sure it gets done right.

2) Take a friend who can sit at the table and "help"

3) Have a friend sit at the side of the table with a very discreet stopwatch. During the game you keep your count arm going all the time, but your head isn't counting. Then when you do need to adjust the clock, it looks like you've got definite knowledge, which you do, with the help of your friend.

4) Be sure you and your partner are both highly attuned to the clock, and are constantly nagging at the clock person. In the OP, partner should have scuttled past the table and even pushed the button, if necessary. Maybe your association could assign it as a 3-whistle game so you'd have enough eyes for all 10 players and the clock.

Originally Posted by ronald

Questions and a thought:

1) Did you or another official have some type of discussion with the timer about procedures for starting the clock? Seems from your post that this was an ongoing issue that the officials were not aware of or were aware of it and did not do anything proactive to rectify the clock management.

Yes, we had the usual pre-game convo about all the ins & outs of running the clock properly.

2) Sounds like a good issue for the vetererns on this board to give thoughtful guidance on how to handle a situation of this nature.

Although I'm grateful for the posters who have shared thusfar, I'm hoping some of the vets with decades worth of experience will chime in.

3) Is there anything specific in the rules that allows one to blow the whistle, go to the timer and tell em to start the clock when the ball is now inbounded?


Is there? Even if I knew it, I would sure hate to take a scoring opportunity away from the offense, down by 8

4) If not a specific rule (do not remember one), how about the all encomposing one that allows the referee to make decisions not specifically addressed in the rules?

Thanks

Thank you!