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-   -   What would you do? FT situation (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/50014-what-would-you-do-ft-situation.html)

JS 20 Mon Nov 24, 2008 11:03am

What would you do? FT situation
 
Working a game this past saturday and the coach of the team in question is a highly successful and respected former HS official. Opposing team is shooting 2. I'm the trail, my partner bounces the ball to the shooter. Just as the ball is about to hit the shooter's hands, the defensive player closest to the shooter leaves his lane space and walks towards half court. I signal the delayed violation. Coach goes crazy and says we need to blow that dead and start over b/c the shooter didn't have the ball yet. The shot was good so it didn't affect anything. I'm thinking the black and white answer is that it's a violation b/c the ball is at the shooter's disposal once my partner released it, however from a game management POV, would you blow it dead and start over since he was moving before the shooter caught the ball? Thanks for your input.

Scrapper1 Mon Nov 24, 2008 11:22am

Quote:

Originally Posted by JS 20 (Post 552767)
we need to blow that dead and start over b/c the shooter didn't have the ball yet.

I suppose you don't have to, but I would've.

Quote:

it's a violation b/c the ball is at the shooter's disposal once my partner released it,
Oops. . .

Ch1town Mon Nov 24, 2008 11:22am

Ball is at the FTers dispossal when it is caught after the official bounces it to them.
Not sure on the proper procedure, but I doubt I would re-administer just because the defense chose to move after the ball is a split second from the shooter.

Depending on time & score that could be viewed as a "freeze" tactic without using a TO.

JS 20 Mon Nov 24, 2008 11:29am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scrapper1 (Post 552771)
I suppose you don't have to, but I would've.

Oops. . .


Why is it oops? 8-1 Art 1 says "...the ball shall be placed at the disposal of the free thrower (bounced) by the administering official..."

I'm interpreting that to say that it's at the disposal of the thrower WHEN it's bounced. Is that incorrect? I don't see anything to say it's at the thrower's disposal when they catch it.

Scrapper1 Mon Nov 24, 2008 11:31am

Quote:

Originally Posted by JS 20 (Post 552776)
Why is it oops? 8-1 Art 1 says "...the ball shall be placed at the disposal of the free thrower (bounced) by the administering official..."

I'm interpreting that to say that it's at the disposal of the thrower WHEN it's bounced. Is that incorrect? I don't see anything to say it's at the thrower's disposal when they catch it.

Definitions, my friend, definitions. Rule 4 is your best friend on the court. :)

4-4-7b.

Indianaref Mon Nov 24, 2008 11:33am

Quote:

Originally Posted by JS 20 (Post 552776)
Why is it oops? 8-1 Art 1 says "...the ball shall be placed at the disposal of the free thrower (bounced) by the administering official..."

I'm interpreting that to say that it's at the disposal of the thrower WHEN it's bounced. Is that incorrect? I don't see anything to say it's at the thrower's disposal when they catch it.

. A ball is at the disposal of a player when it is:

a. Handed to a thrower or free thrower.
b. Caught by a player after it is bounced to him/her.
c. Placed on the floor at the spot.
d. Available to a player after a goal.

JS 20 Mon Nov 24, 2008 11:34am

That's why I posted. I knew I'd get the answer here. Thanks!!

Ch1town Mon Nov 24, 2008 11:35am

Quote:

Originally Posted by JS 20 (Post 552776)
Why is it oops?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ch1town (Post 552772)
Ball is at the FTers dispossal when it is caught after the official bounces it to them.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JS 20 (Post 552776)
I'm interpreting that to say that it's at the disposal of the thrower WHEN it's bounced. Is that incorrect?

No, per 4-4-7(b)

Wow you all are extremely fast for a Monday morning

JugglingReferee Mon Nov 24, 2008 11:39am

Quote:

Originally Posted by JS 20 (Post 552776)
Why is it oops? 8-1 Art 1 says "...the ball shall be placed at the disposal of the free thrower (bounced) by the administering official..."

I'm interpreting that to say that it's at the disposal of the thrower WHEN it's bounced. Is that incorrect? I don't see anything to say it's at the thrower's disposal when they catch it.

When do you start your 10-second count? When the free-throw shooter catches the ball, or when your partner releases the ball to bounce it to the shooter?

zeedonk Mon Nov 24, 2008 11:39am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Indianaref (Post 552779)
. A ball is at the disposal of a player when it is:

a. Handed to a thrower or free thrower.
b. Caught by a player after it is bounced to him/her.
c. Placed on the floor at the spot.
d. Available to a player after a goal.


IAABO alert! Test question! Test question!

Test question: After the ball is bounced to, but before A1 catches the ball for a free throw, B1 and B2 exhange places on the marked lane space. Official rules this a violation on Team B. Is he correct?
No, for the reason stated above.


I only need 49 more answers for tonight...

Z

JS 20 Mon Nov 24, 2008 12:00pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by JugglingReferee (Post 552783)
When do you start your 10-second count? When the free-throw shooter catches the ball, or when your partner releases the ball to bounce it to the shooter?

I usually start right after I report the foul. I like to keep the game moving.

Scrapper1 Mon Nov 24, 2008 12:04pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by JS 20 (Post 552789)
I usually start right after I report the foul. I like to keep the game moving.

Good game management, baby!! :D

JugglingReferee Mon Nov 24, 2008 12:09pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by JS 20 (Post 552789)
I usually start right after I report the foul. I like to keep the game moving.

That's a nice way to keep out of overtime. Don't let him hit that shot to tie the game - call a 10s violation instead!

Adam Mon Nov 24, 2008 12:51pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by JS 20 (Post 552767)
Working a game this past saturday and the coach of the team in question is a highly successful and respected former HS official. Opposing team is shooting 2. I'm the trail, my partner bounces the ball to the shooter. Just as the ball is about to hit the shooter's hands, the defensive player closest to the shooter leaves his lane space and walks towards half court. I signal the delayed violation. Coach goes crazy and says we need to blow that dead and start over b/c the shooter didn't have the ball yet. The shot was good so it didn't affect anything. I'm thinking the black and white answer is that it's a violation b/c the ball is at the shooter's disposal once my partner released it, however from a game management POV, would you blow it dead and start over since he was moving before the shooter caught the ball? Thanks for your input.

Did he make it out passed the 3 pt line prior to the shooter catching the ball? If yes, legal play. If no, violation and good call. I'm not blowing this one back, either way; depending on the level.

Mark Padgett Mon Nov 24, 2008 01:32pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by JugglingReferee (Post 552793)
That's a nice way to keep out of overtime. Don't let him hit that shot to tie the game - call a 10s violation instead!

I like the way this guy thinks. :)


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