Frustrated Loyola coach Patsos takes a seat in the stands
 

Can someone tell me what a "Grad A" technical is? Ever heard or seen anything like this before?

BALTIMORE (AP) — It's not often a college basketball coach passes control of his team to an assistant in the middle of a game, then climbs into the stands to watch the action.
Jimmy Patsos did both Tuesday night.

His Loyola (Md.) team lost to Cornell 82-72 in Boston during the NIT Season Tip-off, and the fifth-year coach insists his actions were warranted.

The trouble began when Patsos was slapped with a technical foul midway through the first half. According to Patsos, instead of calling the technical on the bench, referee John Gaffney told those at the scoring table, "That's a Grade A technical foul on Jimmy Patsos."

Patsos said Gaffney then warned him that he would be thrown out of the arena if he said another word.

"It was a very strange situation," Patsos said Wednesday in a telephone interview with The Associated Press. "I really hadn't done anything in the first place to warrant the technical, and there was no warning. But instead of arguing, I just moved to the other side of the bench and had (assistant) Matt Kovarick call the plays."

Patsos used the time to talk individually to players on his young team. All went well until late in the second half, when Patsos contends Gaffney initiated a switch with another referee to position himself in front of the Loyola bench.

Gaffney then "yelled at me and my assistants," Patsos said.

Patsos had no idea how to react.

"I didn't want to get tossed out. I had my hands up in the surrender position," he said.

Patsos said video of the scene shows Loyola athletic director Joe Boylan in the stands, placing his hands on his head in astonishment. Seconds later, Patsos climbed about two rows into the seats to sit behind Boylan and ask for some advice.

"I didn't want to hurt the school or the program, but at that point I really didn't know what to do," Patsos said.

"I just told him to calm down," Boylan said Wednesday. "As far as I'm concerned, he handled the situation well. He made sure there was no way he would be thrown out of the game."

Patsos returned to the bench and stayed calm until the final buzzer.

When Patsos arrived at Loyola five years ago, he inherited a 1-27 team and ultimately turned around the program. Known for his fiery sideline demeanor, Patsos used to sweat through his suit and tie by halftime.

He contends he's now a changed man who doesn't drink, wears a peace sign on his wrist and has far more patience with his players — and officials.

"I've lost weight, feel better and am happy to turn the other cheek," he said.

Boylan said he would take no disciplinary action against Patsos, and lauded his work at the small Jesuit school.

"He's done a remarkable job in a very, very difficult situation," Boylan said. "His passion is the conduit."

Notice this is a quote from Patsos as to what the official said, not what the table or the official said the official actually said. I can't believe either that the official said "Grade A" or mentioned the coach by name. The story also implies the coach thinks technicals should be called only on the "bench" and that a prior warning is a requirement. Nuff said.

I believe NCAA went to "Class A" technicals this year.

I think it was NCAA Men only.

Yep. In NCAA women's technicals are still classified as they were in the past.

"Seconds later, Patsos climbed about two rows into the seats to sit behind Boylan and ask for some advice."

So why wasn't a second technical foul called at this point?

The head coach is clearly out of the coaching box.

And "Class B" too. ;)

Class A and Class B
 

Class A technicals are for players that committ a technical foul for cursing, contact during dead ball or any flagrant. 9 different reasons.

Class A technicals are for bench inappropriate behavior. If it is on an assitant, then the coach is charged with the A. The call was correct. However, the coach only gets a Class B charged directly to him if the foul was on bench personel other than him. THis tallies towards ejection.

Class B technical for players are for using tobacco, face guarding, dunking in pregame etc. 15 different reasons...

Class B technical for coaches are coaching box violation, bench area, using tobacco, wrong numbers etc. Why was he not charged for leaving the bench is anyones guess. My guess is the offiicial never saw it. They can't say a word sounds more like a NFHS enforcement to me. College coaches do not loose the get up and coach privilege like in HS.

THe big differences between A and B:

A counts toward team totals and player totals, B does not. They all count towards disqualification, 2a's or 1a and 2b's or 3b's.

To be clear, the assistant receives the Class A and the HC would receive a Class B.

Obviously the coaching box has a defined width but does the coaching box have a defined depth? Do the officials really care if he is two rows back? I don't think they would care as long as he's not up in the media area looking at replays of a controversial call :rolleyes:

-Josh

Section 8 Art 1
The coaching box shall extend from the sideline to the back of the team benches and shall be bound by the end line and no farther than the 28-foot line as noted in the diagram.

Since he already had one class he isn't allowed out of the box to do anything they could have gotten him for it. Especially for coming back to the bench.

Didn't know that. Sorry, I was too lazy to look it up

-Josh

What bothers me about this whole situation is that the official supposedly said the coach's name to the table, not "white coach" or whatever color the uniform was. If I did that in a HS game (and I know so many coaches because they are sometimes football coaches or football officials and I work football as well) I would get downgraded and can kiss the postseason goodbye or forget about getting far into the postseason.

At least the sportswriter said the the coach said that the official said.... ;)

"He's the best official we've got, but of the 247 fouls he called this year one of them was reported incorrectly to the scorer. No playoffs for him." :confused:

Do You Get To Carry A Cheat Sheet In Your Pocket ???
 

I hope that the NFHS doesn't go to this. Directs, and indirects, are enough for me to handle.

I disagree with your philosophy. The team members have numbers, but the rest of the bench personnel do not. There is nothing wrong with specifying the offender. Had it been an asst coach how would you distinguish which one?

What I've been taught is you identify the assistant coach by what he/she is wearing or a description, and then if they want a specific name, then ask the head coach to assist you with that. I've always been told never to address a coach by his/her name, even if I know what their name is.

No, I was not saying an incorrect report, but rather what is considered an inappropriate report. The coaches can evaluate officials in Nebraska, and the state does send out evaluators. I've heard some officials got docked for using the coach's name in reporting the technical to the table instead of "blue head coach" (or whatever color his/her team is).

Me: "I've got a technical foul on the blue assistant coach."
Scorer: "Which one?"
Me: "The obnoxious one. Oh wait, that doesn't narrow it down. Sorry."

You'll find there's a split amongst even experienced officials. I never refer to a coach as anything but their first name. My feeling is that if I call them coach, it shows I can't even bother to remember their name. OMM (and does) V.

Two points which are pertinent to this discussion, which I posted earlier, and for some reason Bob deleted are: calling coaches and players by their names when officiating and physically touching the players during the game.

There are vast differences of opinions on these two points. There are some officials who believe that both of these are fine and help establish a good rapport with the participants and can prevent a great deal of trouble. There are others, mostly the newer breed, who seem overly concerned with political correctness and lawsuits and seem to believe that engaging in either is a criminal act.

I don't see why Bob deleted that part of my previous post, especially since other posters have continued the thread by discussing my first point.

We've been reminded this year to NEVER touch a player or coach except for shaking hands during the pre-game conference.

Chest Bumps, And Fist Bumps ...
 

During the 2006-07 season I received my first chest-bump, ever, from one of the captains, at the coaches/captains/officials pregame conference. Didn't really care for it. I'm glad that we just shook hands when I played high school basketball back in 19@#.

Also, during the introductions of starters, many players will give the officials, and the opposing coach a fist bump, instead of a handshake. And, no, it's not the O'Bama terrorist fist bump. By the way, isn't it great to have a fine Irish lad like O'Bama as our next president. I can't wait to see a photo of him. He probably has red hair, and freckles. Can't figure out how his parents came up with his first name. Patrick O'Bama sounds much better.

I much prefer the fist bump to a hand shake. I've got a long season ahead of me. I don't need to be shaking 10 of the most unsanitary hands in the gym every night.

I'm sure that the girls' moms are thrilled that you just wrote that. ;)

By whom? Did you ask why? Did they give you a legitimate reason?

I happen to be on the other side of this. Of course, I learned how to officiate from an old D1 guy and a former FIFA soccer referee. Neither one cared for political correctness. Neither cared about how you looked only what you called. They were only concerned that the referee controlled the game and prevented a melee.

His Name Is Adrian Monk, I Think His Day Job Is A Private Detective ...
 

I once worked with a partner that kept a small squeeze bottle of hand sanitizer in his jacket pocket. After the introduction of starters, during the National Anthem, he would sanitize his hands.

Common Sense V. Political Correctness ...
 

Here's a legitimate reason: Nowadays, anybody, can sue anybody, for any reason, and even if you're in the right, you still have to hire a lawyer to defend yourself.

On the other hand, if a player takes a hard fall, and gets up, and is walking "wobbly", while we're waiting for his beckoned coach, I'm going to put my arm around his, or yes, even her, shoulders, to prevent the player from falling again, thus preventing another, possibly worse, injury. When it comes to player safety, I'll take common sense over political correctness anyday.

Yep, those same moms that have spent the last decade and a half reminding their little girls to wash their hands. :D

It seems he likes being in the news......
 

His team held S. Curry scoreless by double-teaming him the ENTIRE game. Therefore Davidson played 4 on 3 and blewout Loyola.

ESPN - Loyola (MD) vs. Davidson - Recap - November 25, 2008

Curry held scoreless on just three shots, but Davidson still blows out Loyola

DAVIDSON, N.C. -- By the third possession, Davidson's Stephen Curry had figured it out. Loyola (Md.) was double-teaming him. Everywhere, on each possession, no matter what the scenario.

So Curry decided to test the triangle-and-2 defense taken to the ultimate extreme. He went into the corner and two defenders followed him, setting up a 4-on-3 for his teammates.

Curry decided to keep standing there, and his teammates kept scoring -- for 40 minutes -- in a 78-48 head-scratching win for the Wildcats (No. 25 on ESPN/USA Today, No. 24 AP) that will be remembered for some time.

The nation's leading scorer was held without a point and took only three shots. But the game was never in doubt because Davidson played the entire game on a virtual power play.

All this was courtesy of a bizarre coaching move by Loyola's Jimmy Patsos.

"We had to play against an NBA player tonight," Patsos explained. "Anybody else ever hold him scoreless? I'm a history major. They're going to remember that we held him scoreless or we lost by 30?"

Some will remember the catcalls Patsos received from the fans when he stuck with the defense well after the game was decided. Davidson coach Bob McKillop was so annoyed he kept Curry in the game until the final minute.

"It seemed to me they were willing to risk the game at the expense of locking Steph up," McKillop said. "When you put two people on somebody and you do it for 30 minutes and at the end of the game, you have to wonder what the reasons for that are."

Curry, the darling of last season's NCAA tournament, had scored a career-high 44 points in a loss at Oklahoma this month. He followed that up with games of 30 and 39 points.

"If Oklahoma can't stop him, how is Loyola College going to stop him?" Patsos asked.

And Curry, coming in averaging 35 points a game, joked that he had the best seat in the house.

"Every dead ball I asked them how long they were going to do this," Curry said he asked his shadowing defenders. "They really didn't say anything. They weren't very conversational about it."

"I know the fans are mad at me, but I had to roll the dice as far as a coach goes. I'm not some rookie coach," said Patsos, a former longtime assistant at Maryland. "I won a national title as a top assistant coach to Gary Williams. For 13 years I spent on Tobacco Road. I coached a couple of No. 1 picks in the draft. And we scored 48 points. That's the problem that Loyola basketball had today."

"I don't think irritate is the word. Just confused," Curry said. "When they're down by that much and still allowing us to get open shots. It kind of surprised me."

It turned out pretty good for his teammates.

"Their coach obviously wanted guys other than Steph to beat him," Barr said. "If you're playing 4-on-3 against us, somebody is going to hurt you."

I would fall into the newer breed. I'm starting my 5th year of officiating.

I don't have much of an opinion on the names deal. We have have 112 HS with between 4-6 coaches per team. You would have to ref a awful long time to develop a rapport with all of them..I keep it polite and professional. I call them coach. No one has ever had a problem with that. :)

I'm also not a toucher. :cool:Not because of wanting to look PC but I feel its not appropriate for someone my age to be touching high school boys and girls.:eek: I know there are exceptions to every rule and if some kids life was in danger I would break my own rule . But generally speaking I have a pretty strict hands off policy, which I comfortable with...To each his own...

Lawsuits are something to be concerned about. Does it happen that much, apparently not, but it does happen. I have assets. I want to keep my assets. We all know there are people out there willing to sue over anything. I try to limit my exposure to those people and circumstances.

That helps and also I have my own personal liability insurance that covers my assets and then some.So I'm good.:)