Hey! You try and read 40 of these posts while your head hurts! It ain't easy!

(Besides, remember the old saying, "What have you done for me lately?" ;) )

I think BITS and Scrappy covered it well by saying the committee was just trying to close a potential loophole in the traveling provisions, rather than expanding on player-control and dribbling definitions. I can't imagine they are really saying that setting the ball on the floor is the same as dribbling.

Well put, I think, and looking at it that way, this is a loophole that is still open.
As far as I'm concerned, if the player set the ball on the floor and the ball does not move, he can do anything he wants without a violation. Pick it up whether he moves his feet or not, start a dribble, whatever.

casebook 4.15 " It is not a dribble when a player stands still and holds the ball and touches it to the floor once or more than once"

Doesn't help: the case play envisions a player holding the ball while touching it to the floor. The current question concerns a player who is not holding the ball with his hands while it is on the floor.

Gmoore,
Yeah, that was a given. ;)
If you happen to read through the wordy thread, we were wondering what we should do if the player put the ball down on the floor, but then quit holding it, and then, the player picked the ball up again.

In all reality, I cannot envision a player setting the ball down slow enough that it doesn't roll even slightly. It moves a hair and you have the "infinitely smallest" definition of a push; therefore the start of a dribble.

On the other hand, he sets the ball down with both hands, wipes his hands on his socks and then bats the ball hard enough with one hand so that it starts bouncing....play on.

while we're splitting hairs.....
 

The definition of a dribble includes the phrase "pushes the ball to the floor." The infinitely small push you refer to here occurs after the ball is placed on the floor.

I am pushing the ball to the floor...I can push a lot of things without letting go....

I think I speak for us all when I say: HUH?

I "pushed" the ball to the floor and it eversoslightly moved after I let go...a dribble.

So you are saying the phrases "pushed the ball to the floor" and "placed the ball on the floor" are interchangeable? I disagree.

A dribble is BALL MOVEMENT caused by a player...

...pushed, placed, batted, tapped, purposely dropped, rolled.....all kinds of verbs

Just hung up with the assignor from our area.
They're calling it a dribble.

:p

Just Another Ref, FWIW I do see both sides......:)

If that is the only part of the definition you consider, then a pass is also a dribble, a try is also a dribble, tapping a jump ball is also a dribble, grabbing a rebound is also a dribble...there's going to be a heckuva lot of illegal dribble violations in that game.

Fortunately, the actual definition limits the universe of possible ball movements to two specific ones: batting or pushing the ball to the floor.