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-   -   Clock reads 0:00 (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/49264-clock-reads-0-00-a.html)

Back In The Saddle Tue Oct 07, 2008 02:39pm
I could go with that interp...

IF we make sure that both teams also know how much time is left on the clock. IF only the officials are privy to that information, it's unfair to the teams to use it.

Camron Rust Tue Oct 07, 2008 04:14pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nevadaref (Post 541762)
Camron,
You are failing to follow the sound advice of "always listen to Bob!" ;)

The tenths need to be on the visible game clock, which is the one that can be seen by the players during the game. The console at the table doesn't meet that requirement.

According to 1-15 your official clock has to be a visible game clock.
Rule 1 SECTION 15 CLOCK AND SCOREBOARD
A visible game clock and scoreboard are mandatory.

Requiring that a clock be visible in no way precludes the use of other, smaller, displays of the same clock (in the console) for more accurate information. It only establishes that at least one "visible" clock must exist.

By what rule do you exclude use of the console display? Does the console display the time left on the clock/game or not? Are you saying the clock on the console is invisible? ;)

In fact, define "visible". I can see the console from 100ft. away....it may not be legible from that far, but it is visible.

Remember that any situation where <=0.3s is relevant will start with a deadball and the clock stopped: a throwin, FT, or, in a ridiculously extreme sequence of events, a jump ball. This is easily a situation where the exact amount of time can be determined and, if necessary, communicated.

icallfouls Tue Oct 07, 2008 05:07pm
OK, so now I have to get together with my partners and see if they had any information to give about the time on the clock. My partners say .4, the clock operator looks down, starts leaning on his buzzer to alert us to the fact that his clock says .2 Now what?

just another ref Tue Oct 07, 2008 05:53pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by icallfouls (Post 541800)
OK, so now I have to get together with my partners and see if they had any information to give about the time on the clock. My partners say .4, the clock operator looks down, starts leaning on his buzzer to alert us to the fact that his clock says .2 Now what?
Where did your partners get their information?

BktBallRef Tue Oct 07, 2008 07:44pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by icallfouls (Post 541800)
OK, so now I have to get together with my partners and see if they had any information to give about the time on the clock. My partners say .4, the clock operator looks down, starts leaning on his buzzer to alert us to the fact that his clock says .2 Now what?
Huh? :confused:

BTW, I'm with Camron.

A school buys a new console that has tenths but the scoreboard doesn't. The scoreboard shows 0:00 but the horn hasn't sounded. The console shows .2 seconds remaining. Even though you have definite knowledge that .2 remains, you're going to ignore that and guess whether a successful shot is good or not, rather than immediately waving it off.

There's no way you're going to make me believe you're going to count the basket when you know there's .2 left. That's just plain dumb.

just another ref Tue Oct 07, 2008 09:32pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by BktBallRef (Post 541814)
BTW, I'm with Camron.

A school buys a new console that has tenths but the scoreboard doesn't. The scoreboard shows 0:00 but the horn hasn't sounded. The console shows .2 seconds remaining.
There's no way you're going to make me believe you're going to count the basket when you know there's .2 left.
I'm for all this, also, but as BITS suggested above, we should certainly notify the coaches of the .2, agreed?

BktBallRef Wed Oct 08, 2008 12:06am
Quote:
Originally Posted by just another ref (Post 541846)
I'm for all this, also, but as BITS suggested above, we should certainly notify the coaches of the .2, agreed?
I would hope so. I'm quite sure there's going to be some discussion since the clock says 0:00.

Nevadaref Wed Oct 08, 2008 01:50am
Quote:
Originally Posted by BktBallRef (Post 541814)
Huh? :confused:

BTW, I'm with Camron.

A school buys a new console that has tenths but the scoreboard doesn't. The scoreboard shows 0:00 but the horn hasn't sounded. The console shows .2 seconds remaining. Even though you have definite knowledge that .2 remains, you're going to ignore that and guess whether a successful shot is good or not, rather than immediately waving it off.

There's no way you're going to make me believe you're going to count the basket when you know there's .2 left. That's just plain dumb.
That's exactly what I'm going to do. I'm going to judge whether or not the try is released prior to the horn. I'm going to handle this play in the same way that we did before the .3 rule came into NFHS play.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Camron Rust (Post 541814)
By what rule do you exclude use of the console display?
Camron, check out 2-4-2. ;)

Raymond Wed Oct 08, 2008 07:51am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smitty (Post 541738)
You've never seen a scoreboard that doesn't show 10ths and neither does the console? That's why no one would know how many tenths are left and therefore why you couldn't know if there was .3 seconds or not - therefore the rule.
Huh :confused::confused::confused:

Yeah, I've seen plenty of them. Which means no one knows how many 10th's of a second are left which means the rule does apply at those venues.

slow whistle Wed Oct 08, 2008 08:13am
Quote:
Originally Posted by BktBallRef (Post 541814)
Huh? :confused:

BTW, I'm with Camron.

A school buys a new console that has tenths but the scoreboard doesn't. The scoreboard shows 0:00 but the horn hasn't sounded. The console shows .2 seconds remaining. Even though you have definite knowledge that .2 remains, you're going to ignore that and guess whether a successful shot is good or not, rather than immediately waving it off.

There's no way you're going to make me believe you're going to count the basket when you know there's .2 left. That's just plain dumb.
What to do if you don't have a tiemout before the last second play, and therefore no opportunity to go to the table to check the 10ths left on the console? Are you going to make a point to walk over to the table to check the console? Or are you saying you will use the 10ths on the console only if you have an opportunity to check, ie a timeout?

bob jenkins Wed Oct 08, 2008 08:26am
Quote:
Originally Posted by slow whistle (Post 541907)
What to do if you don't have a tiemout before the last second play, and therefore no opportunity to go to the table to check the 10ths left on the console? Are you going to make a point to walk over to the table to check the console? Or are you saying you will use the 10ths on the console only if you have an opportunity to check, ie a timeout?
The rule only applies if the clock is stopped -- so there's always an opportunity to check (before the FT, or before the throw in)

slow whistle Wed Oct 08, 2008 08:33am
Quote:
Originally Posted by bob jenkins (Post 541909)
The rule only applies if the clock is stopped -- so there's always an opportunity to check (before the FT, or before the throw in)
Right, but what if you have a throw in along the endline and there is no official near the table. Will you hold the throw-in and have an official walk over to the table and check the console? If we are going to do that then I would think we better have a clear interpretation of whether or not we are allowed to use the information by rule....from the back and forth here it does not seem clear to me...

slow whistle Wed Oct 08, 2008 08:40am
One thing I am taking from this thread is that I am going to be sure to pre-game this with my partners and come to a consensus as to how we are going to interpret this, whereas in the past I'm not sure it would have come up...although I can't remember the last time I called a game where the clock didn't have 10ths of a second so whole thing is probably irrelevant...want to bet me that my first game this year is in a gym with no 10ths?:D

Raymond Wed Oct 08, 2008 08:48am
Wouldn't this be perfect for MTD, Sr to send to the NFHS for an interp?

BktBallRef Wed Oct 08, 2008 08:57am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nevadaref (Post 541898)
That's exactly what I'm going to do. I'm going to judge whether or not the try is released prior to the horn. I'm going to handle this play in the same way that we did before the .3 rule came into NFHS play.
Good luck explaining that over legalistic ruling to your assigner and state association. That just ain't smart and not supported by rule. You have the game timing device and definite knowledge as to how much time is ion the clock. Gotta be smarter than that. Otherwise, you look like http://www.runemasterstudios.com/gra...es/stooges.gif.

Have at it, fellas. I've added my $.02.


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