Travelling or Block?
 

Came up in recent rules meeting . . . happened tonight. Which rule prevails?

A1 comes down with rebound. B2 behind him stumbles to the floor. A1 turns to begin dribble and trips over B2.

Travelling violation on A1?

. . . or . . .

Blocking foul on B2 who, without both feet on the floor, lacks a "legal guarding position"?

I'm not so much interested in "What would you call?", rather "What is the rule?"

NFHS - B1 doesn't have to have a legal guarding position. Every player is entitled to a space on the floor, as long as he obtains it legally. He obtained his space on the floor legally, without contacting another player. I can't tell you if A1 traveled or not. You said he started a dribble, so who knows?

NCAA - Blocking foul.

BBRef,
I'm curious as to why you think this is a block in NCAA. IMO, guard obtained LGP, and nothing in the subsequent movement was illegal. What am I missing?

Long story short: Even though the NFHS and NCAA rules are, word for word, the same. An NCAA Approved Ruling (and a stupid ruling, in my humble opinion, than cannot be supported by rule) states that this is a block. Go figure.

MTD, Sr.

I would love to see anyone, in real time, call this as anything but a foul on the B player.

You wwill not ever see me call a foul on B2 in an NFHS game and I would be hard pressed to call a foul on B2 in an NCAA game.

MTD, Sr.


P.S. Under NFHS rules why would you ever call a foul on B2 is this case?

Sorry, your opinion is wrong. ;)

NCAA A.R. 91.

Perhaps just like you're ignoring the NCAA rule, he's ignoring the NFHS rule. :rolleyes:

I will confess that I didn't recall the AR. But, when I went into the case book, I think, perhaps, we might have 2 different sitches.

If I read the original post correctly, B established LGP on a player with the ball before falling.

A.R. 87 (this year's book) has the B falling before A gets the ball, therefore never establishing LGP on a player with the ball.

I'm sticking with my opinion (even if it's wrong :p ).

LGP isn't relevant to a stationary player.

So sixer, you're saying that once he has LGP, he can't lose it, no matter what he does, including lying down on the floor?

Disagree with that.
NFHS 4-23-4
NCAA 4-35

BBRef,
Not necessarily. However, lying on the floor does not cause contact. He doesn"t need to continue to have a foot on the floor. But, I'd have to see it to make an informed decision. As described above, I can"t definitively say block.

E.G., if the player fell to the floor to his side and then was run tripped over, I would call that a block. But falling straight back (my assumption of the described play), I can't see me calling it a block in either HS or College, and I'd live with the grief and explain as best I could if I had a chance to.

Tony:

I didn't say I would ignore the NCAA ruling, I said that I would be hard pressed to enforce it; I would make the call per the ruling but I wouldn't like it one bit.. It is a ruling that cannot be defended by rule and that just makes my very very irritated.

MTD, Sr,

Had this exact play on our state rules exam. Still much discussion going on about this situation.