heres one really tough one

[Hard]

The way I see this, Fritz handled it appropriately. Isn't this covered by 9-1-2?
Penalty for violation of the free throw provision by the free-thrower's opponent is to allow the free-thrower an additional try.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Hard

The way I see this, Fritz handled it appropriately. Isn't this covered by 9-1-2?
Penalty for violation of the free throw provision by the free-thrower's opponent is to allow the free-thrower an additional try.

R9-1-2 isn't the applicable rule, as already noted above, This situation is covered under rule 10-1-5(c). Case book play 10.1.5SiTC(b) is the exact play being discussed. Fritz had it wrong.

[Hard]

JR-
I think in this case, BOTH references are applicable. I just read 10.1.5.sitC and I concede that it is exactly as you say; however, reading 9.1.2sitA, it also covers this same situation, and states that the technical will be assessed after the first attempt at the second free throw - which, I think, is the way Fritz had it lined up.

The two situations are so similar - it seems to me that 10.1.5sitC allows for immediate T's, but 9.1.2sitA allows for a little leniency, so you could use either case to justify how you deal with it.

And I like the way Fritz handled it.

[M&M Guy]

Originally Posted by Hard

JR-
I think in this case, BOTH references are applicable. I just read 10.1.5.sitC and I concede that it is exactly as you say; however, reading 9.1.2sitA, it also covers this same situation, and states that the technical will be assessed after the first attempt at the second free throw - which, I think, is the way Fritz had it lined up.

The two situations are so similar - it seems to me that 10.1.5sitC allows for immediate T's, but 9.1.2sitA allows for a little leniency, so you could use either case to justify how you deal with it.

And I like the way Fritz handled it.

The reason 9.1.2 SIT.A isn't applicable is because that is dealing with a delay after a TO. There was no TO in the OP.

[rockyroad]

Originally Posted by M&M Guy

The reason 9.1.2 SIT.A isn't applicable is because that is dealing with a delay after a TO. There was no TO in the OP.

Agreed. There is a difference between a delay situation and a refusal to put the players in their spots...one gets you a warning as per 9.1.2, and the other gets you rung up as per 10.1.5!

[Hard]

One more attempt at justification:

The case book 9.1.2 sitA is for a delay following T.O., but is in reference to the rule 9-1-2 and the penalties for violation of 9-1-2. That rule and the penalties for violation do not reference any conditions as to whether it is after a T.O. or after a foul. It seems that if the defense's coach wants to buy a few seconds with a guaranteed-made free-throw, the rule doesn't say you have to T him/her.

I still think, in reading both these situations and Fritz's account, that Fritz got it right - or at least he can say (based on the readings) that he didn't get it wrong. Am I just being thick, or is there some room for judgement?

[BillyMac]

Does this situation change depending on if the free throws are immediately after the foul, as described in the original post, or if the free throws follow a time out?

Edit: Sorry for the duplication. I didn't fully read Hard's post, but I'm still curious about the two situations.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by Hard

Am I just being thick, or is there some room for judgement?

The former.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by rockyroad

Agreed. There is a difference between a delay situation and a refusal to put the players in their spots...one gets you a warning as per 9.1.2, and the other gets you rung up as per 10.1.5!

Yup. You use the resumption of play procedure after a TO or intermission. At all other times, you just tell 'em to get ready. If they don't listen to you...whack.

[Rodical]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Yup. You use the resumption of play procedure after a TO or intermission. At all other times, you just tell 'em to get ready. If they don't listen to you...whack.

The case book sit 10-1-5c does stipulate that "The warning is recorded by the scorer and reported to the head coach", so that should be done before assessing the Technical foul. Right?

[chartrusepengui]

Now - if this all occurs following a TO ......