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Signaling Successful 3-Point Goal From Lead (2-Person)
After some local observation, and some discussion of misconceptions about certain mechanics at tonight's association meeting, I'm just curious.
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I don't mirror my partner in 2-man, but if the try comes from my area and I indicate the 3, I also score it.
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You neglected one more option in your poll: Only if the T does not give it.
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To clarify:
The poll question concerns the only time a Lead is to signal a successful 3-point goal, which is when the try originates in their area. (This does not concern the possibility of a Lead signaling a 3-point attempt in fast transition with the Trail nowhere near covering the play.) |
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I am having some problems understanding where the confusion is...but maybe it's just me. |
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So it's basically a check your local listings question. Here we just follow the manual - seems to work. ;) |
The mechanic we always used was the Lead only signaled a 3 point attempt when it came from their area. Then they would signal it good if it came from their area as well. Only the Trail mirrors the good 3 point shot, and never mirrors the attempt. Not much different than what you do in 3 person.
Peace |
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The Constitution State
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RUT: Did you update the Bucks record against SEC in bowl games after tonight's game. :( MTD, Sr. |
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Peace |
The proper mechanic is if lead marks it they score it and then trail mirrors the score.
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Correct fiba mechanics for this is that if the shot comes from the leads area is that the lead shows "3-point attempt", and holds that signal until he can confirm the trail has mirrored the signal. He must how ever still cover the rebounding and therefore most of the times when this happen you see the lead holding the signal until the ball has either rebounded or entered the basket (if the ball enters he should look at his partner to confirm 3 points have been awarded.
(From the Fiba 2-referee manual - shooting situations- three point attempts [6.3]) The reason the lead won't score the basket (I think, I have no quotes on this) is becuse the trail is responsible for the flight of the ball and therefore he is the logical choice when it comes to scoring the basket (since he sees when and if it is good). |
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OK, who told you.? We want names... names I tell you. That traitor will pay!:p |
I agree with Nevadaref. If I signal the attempt from my area, I also signal the successful goal.
Bottom line is, Trail always signals a successful 3. Lead also signals successful 3 if it originated in his/her PCA. |
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Also the Lead watches the ball go in the basket even in 3 Person. So why is this difficult to do in 2 Person? Peace |
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Thank you for your responses.
It's interesting - I think the responses in the poll mirror the percentages in the association. I think a lot of people were/are unaware that the Fed mechanic is: If you signal the attempt from your area, you signal the successful goal.
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Peace |
Like many have said, I always signal if it comes from my PCA.
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The L has nothing to do with the shot, apart from telling the T that it was a 3 point attempt. Who's watching under the basket if the L is looking at the ball up in the air? And what's the point in mirroring the signal? We want officials to try and avoid double signals, in order to minimize problems that can happen. Officials signal what is in their responsibility to call (or do no signal if there is nothing to call). For example, I advise young officials not to signal a 2 point attempt: it's sufficient not to raise the arm. I believe this "signal" is of the same sort as the "tip" signal on a legal block. If the L doesn't raise the arm when there's a shot from his/her area, it means that the shot was a 2-point attempt. The T knows his/her partner is watching. Ciao |
In 2-man, if the 3 point attempt is in my primary area (probably in the corner), I'm giving the preliminary, staying with the shooter with the preliminary still in the air, once the shooter is back down and clear of any foul, I'm looking in. If the shot goes through, or already went through, I'm giving the "touchdown" signal.
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Yesterday, I made a post in this thread which corrected the poor grammar used by someone else in another post. One of the moderators then saw fit to delete that post. I did not include any insults of any kind. In fact, the only words which I wrote other than the corrections were, "Corrected poor grammar."
I am now expressing my opinion that such action amounts to censorship and favoritism. This is not the first time that a moderator has deleted my post after I corrected a spelling or grammar error of a certain poster. Since numerous posters have done this hundreds of times on this forum, I cannot come up with any other explanation. What this moderator is doing is showing favoritism to someone that he knows, and I have lost a great deal of respect for this person because of that. I just wanted everyone else to know. *** I just read your deleted post. Was it on topic? No. Did it add to the value of the thread? No. Was it inflammatory? It had potential. Was favoritism involved? No. I just wanted everyone else to know. mick |
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Note that this is coming from probably the all-time leader of deleted posts on this forum too. The guys that moderate here have a tough job with all of the A-type personalities involved, but they still do their job very well imo. |
I'll stand up and say that I was the one who deleted the post. And, one of the primary reasons was the history between the two posters involved. In my judgement, the post had the potential to lead to a needless flame war.
I'll also add that both posters involved had previously been warned to stop the senseless back-and-forth sniping and, when they failed to heed that warning, both were placed in time-out for a short period of time. That seemed to wrok for a while, but maybe it needs to be done again. I just wanted everyone else to know. (Brad will probably come along now and (appropriately) close / delete this thread, because it violates one of his rules ) |
In my association, the training class teaches the Lead to mirror the Trail. So, I do it as taught in the two person crew. At times I am late with the signal because my focus is off the ball. However, I have noticed that this causes the Lead to ball watch. This seems to be especially true of the rookies until they get more experience.
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What a moderator did, and has now admitted to, was delete a post that contained no insults and no negative comments purely on the basis of how the other poster could have responed. That's akin to calling a foul on a player because he stood near an opponent and the opposing player could take that the wrong way. That's BS, and that's an offense to free speech. What should have been done was to leave my post alone and delete any inappropriate response made by the other poster. If the other poster can't handle having his writing mistakes pointed out and corrected on a public forum, then he should either improve his writing skills or stop posting. If he is okay with his current writing ability and can handle it when others do what I did, then there is no problem for the mods to fret over. From now on I fully expect the mods to delete every post that Chuck, Juulie or anyone else makes that is a spelling or grammar correction. To do otherwise would be to admit that I am being singled out and that what was done was wrong. |
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Do you really think that we're all stoopid enough to swallow this bushwa, Nevada? Ray Charles and Stevie Wonder could see that you were only posting to yank Rut's chain. I've had my run-ins with Jeff in the past too. I moved on. I forgot about them. He did too, I think. May I suggest that you do the same? |
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My daughter, who has a 3.6 grade average at a her university , just received a very negative rejection letter from the business school(top five in the country) which included three typos. She's not happy with good reason. On an official's forum, you can't expect the Queen's English on every post. That said, I just had a dust up with BlindZebra which I'm going to apologize for in a PM. |
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I am here to talk officiating and to share knowledge I have gained over the years and even from this board. I am not here to get into a pissing war with someone that cannot deal with the facts put directly in front of them. And instead of debating those merits, they start name-calling. I once would have gone back and forth, but it solves nothing and it changes nothing whether is it my opinion or their opinion. Please note that I have stayed away from these kinds of BS threads from this person and I have completely ignored this person without having to put them on an ignore list. I do not know why I am being accused of something that I am currently not doing. Peace |
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Peace |
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http://forum.officiating.com/showthread.php?t=40594 Examples of "little shots" thrown, which his favorite moderator refused to delete even after being advised of them. Of course, my responding post in that thread was quickly deleted. PS Corrected the poor grammar again. |
Nevada - this isn't an English class - it's a discussion forum about officiating.
If your post doesn't add anything to the discussion, it can be deleted by the moderators or me at our discretion. |
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