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Old Wed Feb 06, 2002, 02:04pm
Jerry Blum
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I went along with some veteran officials to do a Boys JV game before the Varsity game last night. Nothing unusual about my game but in the Varsity the first half got very physical and the two official s must have called about 7-8 off ball fouls just in the first half. Home team playing triangle and 2 and face guarding players being manned up. So here is the situation during the game. A1 puts up a shot and returns to the floor(not airborne shooter), B1 knocks down A1 while trying to block him out, Trail calls pushing foul. At almost exactly the same time as the trail blows his whistle Lead blows his calling a pushing foul on A2 who pushed B2 under the basket on the rebound. They come together to talk about what they have and decide that the fouls occurred simultaneously so they call it a double foul and go with the AP arrow and Team A retains possession.

Just wondering if this is what everyone else would have done?
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Old Wed Feb 06, 2002, 02:21pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by Jerry Blum
I went along with some veteran officials to do a Boys JV game before the Varsity game last night. Nothing unusual about my game but in the Varsity the first half got very physical and the two official s must have called about 7-8 off ball fouls just in the first half. Home team playing triangle and 2 and face guarding players being manned up. So here is the situation during the game. A1 puts up a shot and returns to the floor(not airborne shooter), B1 knocks down A1 while trying to block him out, Trail calls pushing foul. At almost exactly the same time as the trail blows his whistle Lead blows his calling a pushing foul on A2 who pushed B2 under the basket on the rebound. They come together to talk about what they have and decide that the fouls occurred simultaneously so they call it a double foul and go with the AP arrow and Team A retains possession.

Just wondering if this is what everyone else would have done?
Jerry,
Sounds like a false double foul.
No throws Each foul carries its own penalty; use the arrow.

Sometimes these "double" foul calls may be used to settle the teams, to get their attention back on the game instead of the opponent.
mick

[Edited by mick on Feb 6th, 2002 at 05:52 PM]
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Old Wed Feb 06, 2002, 02:26pm
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Hi Jerry:
Good to see and visit with you last night. After thinking back on that call, it was probably a false double foul, but nobody had a clue of what happened. Now that I read your analysis, it all changes. But, they sold it.

Great job in the first game.

John
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Old Wed Feb 06, 2002, 02:27pm
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Nope...this is not a double foul. Double fouls are committed by two players AGAINST EACH OTHER... so A1 pushes B3 and B3 pushes A1 at the same time...if there was a provision in the book for it, we could call these simultaneous fouls...unfortunately that only applies to simultaneous technicals...for some of the "older" members, didn't we have pretty much this same discussion last season? I seem to remember two points of view coming out...one was the flase double foul situation already posted, and the other was that the refs get together and "decide" which foul came first and ignore the other one since it wasn't flagrant or intentional...anybody else remember the outcome of that discussion????

[Edited by rockyroad on Feb 6th, 2002 at 01:31 PM]
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Old Wed Feb 06, 2002, 03:14pm
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Definitely a false-double foul (simultaneous personal fouls, 6-3-3g). Shoot the free throws for each foul then go the AP. The NFHS Handbook has a simultaneous personal fouls play on page 84 and tells how to handle it.
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Old Wed Feb 06, 2002, 07:08pm
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Have to go with false double as well. YOUCH!! I HATE those!!!
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