The Official Forum - Timing correction.

The Official Forum (https://forum.officiating.com/)

- Basketball (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/)

- - Timing correction. (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/3480-timing-correction.html)

Quote:

Originally posted by Hawks Coach

Quote:

Originally posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.
Now that everybody has looked up all of the NFHS rules and casebook references I will put in my two cents.

Under NCAA rules the clock is reset to 4.3 seconds. Under NFHS rules I would not reset the clock. 1.8 seconds in within acceptable parameters for reaction time for the official to blew his whistle and for the timer to react to it.

NCAA DOES NOT allow lag time. NFHS DOES allow lag time.

Now under NFHS rules the clock had run out, the official would have been allowed to put time back on the clock. I would have reset it to three seconds.

Mark, there are times where you offer stong and compelling aguments for a unique point of view. But I continue to be amazed at some of your interpretations of clearly stated NFHS rules and cases. Mark Dexter and I came up with the exact same answer yesterday simultaneously (I wrote mine seeing only the sitch and not Mark's response). Mine was based on rules that I have at hand and memory o aout 10-20 postings on this subject. Mark's based his on the rules and on a case book to which he has ready access (what does he do when he is not reading that book!).

What rules or cases can you cite that allow 1.8 seconds of lag time in NFHS, given that Mark Dexter has given us a case that clearly states 1 second is the allowable time. We have had this discussion numerous times on this board, never once have I seen a sustainable claim that greater than 1 second lag time with definite knowledge is acceptable. Where did you derive this?

A1 travels when the clock shows 00:10; the official reacts to A1's travel violation by sounding his whistle when the clock shows 00:09; the timer reacts to the official's whistle by stopping the clock at 00:08. Two seconds has elapsed and everybody reacted well within acceptable limits. That is why 1.8 seconds from the time A1 committed the violation until the clock stops is within the time frame that is acceptable.

I hope that this explains my logic.

Told ya, right or wrong, he'd come up with something! :)

Quote:

Originally posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

Quote:

Originally posted by Hawks Coach

Quote:

Originally posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.
Now that everybody has looked up all of the NFHS rules and casebook references I will put in my two cents.

Under NCAA rules the clock is reset to 4.3 seconds. Under NFHS rules I would not reset the clock. 1.8 seconds in within acceptable parameters for reaction time for the official to blew his whistle and for the timer to react to it.

NCAA DOES NOT allow lag time. NFHS DOES allow lag time.

Now under NFHS rules the clock had run out, the official would have been allowed to put time back on the clock. I would have reset it to three seconds.

Mark, there are times where you offer stong and compelling aguments for a unique point of view. But I continue to be amazed at some of your interpretations of clearly stated NFHS rules and cases. Mark Dexter and I came up with the exact same answer yesterday simultaneously (I wrote mine seeing only the sitch and not Mark's response). Mine was based on rules that I have at hand and memory o aout 10-20 postings on this subject. Mark's based his on the rules and on a case book to which he has ready access (what does he do when he is not reading that book!).

What rules or cases can you cite that allow 1.8 seconds of lag time in NFHS, given that Mark Dexter has given us a case that clearly states 1 second is the allowable time. We have had this discussion numerous times on this board, never once have I seen a sustainable claim that greater than 1 second lag time with definite knowledge is acceptable. Where did you derive this?

A1 travels when the clock shows 00:10; the official reacts to A1's travel violation by sounding his whistle when the clock shows 00:09; the timer reacts to the official's whistle by stopping the clock at 00:08. Two seconds has elapsed and everybody reacted well within acceptable limits. That is why 1.8 seconds from the time A1 committed the violation until the clock stops is within the time frame that is acceptable.

I hope that this explains my logic.

Eesh. :confused:

Quote:

Originally posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.
WHAAAAT!!!

I mean I cannot understand what you call your logic.
That's what.

Violation occured at 00:10 on the clock, official reacts to violation and sounds whistle at 00:09, timer reacts to official's whistle and stops clock at 00:08. Two seconds elapsed from the time the violation occured until the clock stoped and everybody reacted in sequence in an within an acceptable time frame.

That is why I said that if A1 called a timeout with 00:04.3 on the clock and by the time the official reacted to A1's request and the timer responded to the official's whistle, then 1.8 seconds could have elapsed without the official being slow with his whistle and without the timer being slow with his finger on the clock's switch.

Does that clarify things.

That's not what she said, Mark.

He didn't say that the player requested TO at 4.3.

In fact, she didn't tell us how much time was on the clock when the TO request was made.

He said that he blew her whistle and looked at the clock at 4.3.

The clock ticked down to 2.5.

Therefore, the clock must be reset to 3.3, because the whistle was blown at 4.3 seconds.

Now surely, you'll admit that you misread the play and that 3.3 is correct.

My guess is that you'll lose all credibility if you don't. :(

[Edited by BktBallRef on Dec 18th, 2001 at 11:37 PM]

WHOA! WHOA! WHOA! I don't know what gave you that idea, but I definitely am not a she. I was having a good laugh with y'all til I see that. Sheez!!

Sorry, there's is a she on the board with a very similiar username.

No wonder you been on my case lately!

I'm on everybody's case, evidently! :D

BTW, was my description accurate? Did it happen the way I described in my reply to Mark?

Quote:

Originally posted by BktBallRef
I'm on everybody's case, evidently! :D

BTW, was my description accurate? Did it happen the way I described in my reply to Mark?

I await Mark's reply to this one with eager anticipation.:D:

Quote:

Originally posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.
A1 travels when the clock shows 00:10; the official reacts to A1's travel violation by sounding his whistle when the clock shows 00:09; the timer reacts to the official's whistle by stopping the clock at 00:08. Two seconds has elapsed and everybody reacted well within acceptable limits. That is why 1.8 seconds from the time A1 committed the violation until the clock stops is within the time frame that is acceptable.

I hope that this explains my logic.

It explains your logic, but your logic is wrong.

Lag time has nothing to do with how long of a delay is between a foul/violation/anything else and the whistle - lag time is the reaction time of the timer ONLY!!!!!

1) I misread the original play.

2) The casebook play specifically states that lag time is between the whistle and the clock stopping and should never be more that one second.

3) Many times we are lucky to get a look at the clock at the same time of the violation.

My point was to show that officials have to react to the play before he sounds his whistle and that timers have to react to official's whistle before his finger flips the switch. No one wants a lazy timer, but the 1.8 seconds in the posting is a good example of what Bill Russell use to describe and a "long" one second and a "short" one second. For you youthful officials out there, Bill Russell use the be the color commentator for ABC Sports NBA Game of the Week in the early 70's, before the advent of game clocks with tenths of a second displays.

Quote:

Originally posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.
For you youthful officials out there, Bill Russell use the be the color commentator for ABC Sports NBA Game of the Week in the early 70's, before the advent of game clocks with tenths of a second displays.

I thought Bill Russell was an NBA player who won 10 NBA World Championships with the Boston Celtics. ;)