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-   -   timing belt pack... (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/33096-timing-belt-pack.html)

The New Guy Sun Mar 25, 2007 07:00pm

timing belt pack...
 
Any reason they don't use the precision timing mechanism for NCAA tournament games? I don't recall a lot of timing issues in the tournament, but you would think for the highest profile games the sport has, they would use them.

They've been using them in our high school championships for a few years now, it seems that the NCAA would catch on.

It was just an observation. Interested to hear other people's thoughts.

tjones1 Sun Mar 25, 2007 07:05pm

I actually spoke with Mike Costabile after the first weekend of the tournament. Great guy! We got on the topic about several timing issues they had during the opening rounds. Basically he said the NCAA didn't want to give up the money to have PTS at the sites.

BktBallRef Sun Mar 25, 2007 07:08pm

Hopefully, after all the issues they've had this year, they'll spend the money. It's not like they don't have it.

tjones1 Sun Mar 25, 2007 07:14pm

I agree. If this year isn't free advertising for the system, I don't know what is.

TRef21 Sun Mar 25, 2007 07:16pm

you know thats so weird. You would think at all the arena's they are at would be euipt with it. I have always wanted to wear one of those little black boxes, they look so cool.

tjones1 Sun Mar 25, 2007 07:19pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by TRef21
you know thats so weird. You would think at all the arena's they are at would be euipt with it. I have always wanted to wear one of those little black boxes, they look so cool.

It's not the arenas. They are placed accordingly in arenas that have a contract with PT, which are most of the major conferences. So it's not that the arenas can't use the system (in terms of operating capable), it's that they don't have a contract to use the system.

Mark Dexter Sun Mar 25, 2007 07:35pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by tjones1
It's not the arenas. They are placed accordingly in arenas that have a contract with PT, which are most of the major conferences. So it's not that the arenas can't use the system (in terms of operating capable), it's that they don't have a contract to use the system.

Wow - that's really interesting information. I was about to start compiling a list of which stadia do and don't have the PT system already in place. Guess there's no need at this point. I, for one, always just assumed that you bought the system and that was that.

I'm sure that Costabile doesn't want to give up any of his trade secrets, but did he perhaps drop any hints as to how much the licensing/contract fee would be for the entire tourney? I can't think it's enough to be prohibitive to the NCAA.

Mark Dexter Sun Mar 25, 2007 07:39pm

As way of comparison, I believe the current NCAA contract with CBS gives the NCAA $545 million/year (averaged over the term of the contract).

ALL of the D-I championships added together cost about $40 million.

tjones1 Sun Mar 25, 2007 07:50pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Dexter
Wow - that's really interesting information. I was about to start compiling a list of which stadia do and don't have the PT system already in place. Guess there's no need at this point. I, for one, always just assumed that you bought the system and that was that.

I'm sure that Costabile doesn't want to give up any of his trade secrets, but did he perhaps drop any hints as to how much the licensing/contract fee would be for the entire tourney? I can't think it's enough to be prohibitive to the NCAA.

He didn't really say what it costs. I have to agree with you that it can't be that much compared to everything else and what's on the line.

Mark Dexter Sun Mar 25, 2007 07:53pm

I would think that CBS might even be willing to pay for the use of the PT system. I'd bet that the producers HATE every time the refs go to the monitor to correct a timing (not timer's :cool: ) mistake that could have been prevented.

BktBallRef Sun Mar 25, 2007 08:13pm

It's politics, not money.

jeffpea Mon Mar 26, 2007 12:17pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Dexter
I would think that CBS might even be willing to pay for the use of the PT system. I'd bet that the producers HATE every time the refs go to the monitor to correct a timing (not timer's :cool: ) mistake that could have been prevented.

I would think that CBS would like all the game interruptions to check the monitor for timiing issues...that's just another chance to run a commercial!

Mark Dexter Mon Mar 26, 2007 02:14pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeffpea
I would think that CBS would like all the game interruptions to check the monitor for timiing issues...that's just another chance to run a commercial!

Except they usually don't go to commercial (unless they happen to do the review during a team-called or media TO) because they don't know how long the review is going to take.

Also, at the end of a close game, they want their audience to be happy by finding out how the game ends!

TriggerMN Mon Mar 26, 2007 02:27pm

Speaking of commercials, I'm still unsure as to whose country this is...:confused:

M&M Guy Mon Mar 26, 2007 02:42pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by TriggerMN
Speaking of commercials, I'm still unsure as to whose country this is...:confused:

Damn you.

I was just getting that tune outta my head, and now you put it back in there. :D

shave-tail Mon Mar 26, 2007 03:21pm

They must be using this in some games. I was watching a first round game when the camera zoomed in on a player. The official was was in the background and only his waist was visible and there on his belt was a little black box. I was going to post a question of what it was used for, but forgot.:confused:

tjones1 Mon Mar 26, 2007 04:22pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by shave-tail
They must be using this in some games. I was watching a first round game when the camera zoomed in on a player. The official was was in the background and only his waist was visible and there on his belt was a little black box. I was going to post a question of what it was used for, but forgot.:confused:

I'm not sure what you saw, but if it was the NCAA tournament, it wasn't PTS. However, if you look close enough all of them are using the PTS lanyard, probably due to the fact that's the only kind of lanyard they have.

Mark Dexter Mon Mar 26, 2007 04:30pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by shave-tail
They must be using this in some games. I was watching a first round game when the camera zoomed in on a player. The official was was in the background and only his waist was visible and there on his belt was a little black box. I was going to post a question of what it was used for, but forgot.:confused:

Methinks you were watching an NIT game.

Tjones - any idea on why the licensing is approved for the NIT but not the NCAA D-I tourney?

tjones1 Mon Mar 26, 2007 05:01pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Dexter
Methinks you were watching an NIT game.

Tjones - any idea on why the licensing is approved for the NIT but not the NCAA D-I tourney?

Mark,

Not sure, it may be that the first rounds are usually played on one team's home court. Therefore, if they have the system they may be allowed it use it.

Old School Mon Mar 26, 2007 05:28pm

How do these things work? Is there like a priority mechanism that the official responsible for starting the clock has the primary, or can any official start the clock. Has there ever been times where the clock was accidentally started by an official. Also, with the remote technology, it is possible for somebody to jam the system. Just curious!

Adam Mon Mar 26, 2007 06:18pm

I believe the FCC can jam the system if they so desire; however, they have to invoke the PATRIOT Act and the Riot Act by calling the FBI and CIA. They try to keep the DOD out of it, though.

Mark Dexter Mon Mar 26, 2007 07:03pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells
I believe the FCC can jam the system if they so desire; however, they have to invoke the PATRIOT Act and the Riot Act by calling the FBI and CIA. They try to keep the DOD out of it, though.

Only if it benefits Duke.

Jurassic Referee Mon Mar 26, 2007 07:09pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Old School
Also, with the remote technology, it is possible for somebody to jam the system.

He's now a perfect 542 for 542.

Stay tuned.

BktBallRef Mon Mar 26, 2007 07:17pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Dexter
Except they usually don't go to commercial (unless they happen to do the review during a team-called or media TO) because they don't know how long the review is going to take.

Also, at the end of a close game, they want their audience to be happy by finding out how the game ends!

Correct.

Quote:

Originally Posted by shave-tail
They must be using this in some games. I was watching a first round game when the camera zoomed in on a player. The official was was in the background and only his waist was visible and there on his belt was a little black box. I was going to post a question of what it was used for, but forgot.:confused:

It was NOT used in the NCAA tournament.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tjones1
I'm not sure what you saw, but if it was the NCAA tournament, it wasn't PTS. However, if you look close enough all of them are using the PTS lanyard, probably due to the fact that's the only kind of lanyard they have.

The lanyards are the same. The only difference is a plastic clip that holds the mic.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Dexter
Methinks you were watching an NIT game.

Tjones - any idea on why the licensing is approved for the NIT but not the NCAA D-I tourney?

The NCAA doesn't own the NIT, anymore than it owns the Great Alaska Shootout.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Old School
How do these things work? Is there like a priority mechanism that the official responsible for starting the clock has the primary, or can any official start the clock. Has there ever been times where the clock was accidentally started by an official. Also, with the remote technology, it is possible for somebody to jam the system. Just curious!

Any of the 2 or 3 officials can start the clock with the pack.

Of course, the clock is started accidentally from time to time.

Now, why in the hell would someone won't to jam it? Good grief.

Jurassic Referee Mon Mar 26, 2007 07:27pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

The NCAA doesn't own the NIT, anymore than it owns the Great Alaska Shootout.

Actually, the NCAA does own the NIT, Tony.
http://www.usatoday.com/money/2005-0...purchase_x.htm

shave-tail Mon Mar 26, 2007 07:30pm

[QUOTE=Mark Dexter]Methinks you were watching an NIT game.


Mark,

You probably correct. Watched toooooooo much basketball this year.:eek:

Mark Dexter Mon Mar 26, 2007 08:33pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee
Actually, the NCAA does own the NIT, Tony.
http://www.usatoday.com/money/2005-0...purchase_x.htm

Beat me to it.

Although I think my question was regardless of the NCAA/NIT relationship.

tjones1 Mon Mar 26, 2007 09:27pm

Right, I'm just seeing that most of them aren't taking the clip off.

BktBallRef Mon Mar 26, 2007 10:38pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee
Actually, the NCAA does own the NIT, Tony.
http://www.usatoday.com/money/2005-0...purchase_x.htm

Well, you learn something everyday. I knew that it was owned by the NY area schools. I did not realize the NCAA had purchased.

With that in mind, I would agree that the decision to use PT is a local decision with all the early games being played at the higher seed. Let's wait to see if PT is used tomorrow night in MSG.

And if they do, the greater question is, will terrorists jam the signal? http://www.runemasterstudios.com/gra...otallthere.gif

BktBallRef Mon Mar 26, 2007 10:39pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by tjones1
Right, I'm just seeing that most of them aren't taking the clip off.

That's because it can be a 8itch to get back on!

Jurassic Referee Tue Mar 27, 2007 02:24am

Quote:

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

And if they do, the greater question is, will terrorists jam the signal? http://www.runemasterstudios.com/gra...otallthere.gif

Could be the end of civilization as we know it.

Can we have the FBI investigate Old School?

dblref Tue Mar 27, 2007 06:10am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Dexter
Only if it benefits Duke.

Jealousy is such a petty emotion.:D

tjones1 Tue Mar 27, 2007 10:31am

Quote:

Originally Posted by BktBallRef
That's because it can be a 8itch to get back on!

Yep, very true.


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