confused

[bossref]

The officials are charged with making
the proper/correct calls.
If your partner missed something, GO GET IT
especially if you are absolutely sure.
If your partner cares about doing what's right,
he will thank you.
If his ego is most important, he may be upset.
Your job is to make the game fair for both teams
and to penalize fouls and violations as they occur.
Always do the right thing by the players
and explain to your partner that you don't want to infringe
on his primary area, but will, if the game is on the line or if the foul is on the shot (protect the shooter).
Hang in there and have the courage to make the right
call, even if it may not be the most popular.
The seasoned veterans know that it is important
to make the right call even if you have to slightly
bruise the ego of your partner.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally posted by bossref
The officials are charged with making
the proper/correct calls.
If your partner missed something, GO GET IT
especially if you are absolutely sure.
If your partner cares about doing what's right,
he will thank you.
If his ego is most important, he may be upset.
Your job is to make the game fair for both teams
and to penalize fouls and violations as they occur.
Always do the right thing by the players
and explain to your partner that you don't want to infringe
on his primary area, but will, if the game is on the line or if the foul is on the shot (protect the shooter).
Hang in there and have the courage to make the right
call, even if it may not be the most popular.
The seasoned veterans know that it is important
to make the right call even if you have to slightly
bruise the ego of your partner.

Bossref,if you're going to call everything you want,anywhere you want,any time you want-why do you even need a partner?Ego shouldn't be a factor,but don't you have any trust at all in your partner's judgement?
Seasoned Veteran!

[bossref]

Trusting your partner has nothing to do
with it!Getting the call right does!
Maybe where you ref ALL partners are PERFECT.
There are many times when you've got to let him
have it all:Player driving in to score one on one
and partner not screened out, Action in the midcourt
area, etc etc.
However, in a pre-game with 2 experienced partners
it is best to say: "Hey don't worry about our areas.
If something important happens and you see it for sure,
make the call! That way we both look good."
The players and coaches don't care about whose area
it is. They care about getting the right call.
Why don't you try to think about the game more than
you think about your partner's primary area.
Sometimes partners are screened out.
Sometimes they have a brain fart.
Sometimes they don't bring their A game.
Sometimes action occurs in a "gray area"
or a "shared area. Fullcourt press with a bang
bang play near halfcourt.
Don't go "reaching" into your partner's area
on a regular basis. Respect his area under normal circumstances. But don't be an idiot and ignore
what's really important because you want to
only make calls in your primary area.
Your comment about why do I need a partner if I'm
going to call everything, shows your lack of experience.
I'm not going to call everything, but I will always
protect the shooter and I will always make whatever
call is necessary when a game is on the line,
especially if my partner is sucking on his whistle.
Maybe that's why the players and coaches respect me.
Try dialoging with your partners before the game.
Let them know that you want to cooperate, that
you will be there for "help" if needed, and will only
make calls in their area if you KNOW for SURE
that the call was the right one and absolutely necessary.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally posted by bossref
Trusting your partner has nothing to do
with it!Getting the call right does!
Maybe where you ref ALL partners are PERFECT.
There are many times when you've got to let him
have it all:Player driving in to score one on one
and partner not screened out, Action in the midcourt
area, etc etc.
However, in a pre-game with 2 experienced partners
it is best to say: "Hey don't worry about our areas.
If something important happens and you see it for sure,
make the call! That way we both look good."
The players and coaches don't care about whose area
it is. They care about getting the right call.
Why don't you try to think about the game more than
you think about your partner's primary area.
Sometimes partners are screened out.
Sometimes they have a brain fart.
Sometimes they don't bring their A game.
Sometimes action occurs in a "gray area"
or a "shared area. Fullcourt press with a bang
bang play near halfcourt.
Don't go "reaching" into your partner's area
on a regular basis. Respect his area under normal circumstances. But don't be an idiot and ignore
what's really important because you want to
only make calls in your primary area.
Your comment about why do I need a partner if I'm
going to call everything, shows your lack of experience.
I'm not going to call everything, but I will always
protect the shooter and I will always make whatever
call is necessary when a game is on the line,
especially if my partner is sucking on his whistle.
Maybe that's why the players and coaches respect me.
Try dialoging with your partners before the game.
Let them know that you want to cooperate, that
you will be there for "help" if needed, and will only
make calls in their area if you KNOW for SURE
that the call was the right one and absolutely necessary.

Just one little question.Say you're lead in a close game right at the end,and you get a shot(4 feet in front of you)with a little contact,and,in your judgement the contact didn't affect the shot,or you know the contact was iniated by the shooter--and you therefore pass on the call--what do you say after the game to the trail if he comes in and makes the call on the defense from 20 feet away?Great call,partner?I just think that sometimes you just have to trust your partner's judgement.

[JRutledge]

if you do that crap in my area, you can think that is a lack of experience by the higher brass, but you would not be working very long. "Getting the call right" is one thing, but reaching over and calling stuff you did not see is another. There is a reason you have 2 or 3 officials, you better let them call the game the way they know how. If you do not, you might call things YOU "THINK" are correct, but truely are not. I am sure that you might mean well, but just because something looks bad does not mean that it is a foul. And your best bet is to let your partner decide that on their own.

The bottom line, if your partners are not "GETTING IT RIGHT" they will not be there for long. Remember that.

Peace

[bossref]

Not interested in a pissing contest with you.
Please read the last 4 lines and understand that I
don't profess to making a habit of calling out
of my area (especially right in front of my partner).
BTW Your two rules are great. You must love yourself.
Also it's too bad officials who log on to message boards
like this have to be so defensive.
In answer to the other post above:
If contact is slight AND you know your partner
had a clear view of the play, I would certainly
not infringe upon his judgement.
You are certainly entitled to your opinion.
You should continue to do what works for you.
Peace out.

[JRutledge]

Originally posted by bossref
Not interested in a pissing contest with you.
Please read the last 4 lines and understand that I
don't profess to making a habit of calling out
of my area (especially right in front of my partner).
BTW Your two rules are great. You must love yourself.
Also it's too bad officials who log on to message boards
like this have to be so defensive.
In answer to the other post above:
If contact is slight AND you know your partner
had a clear view of the play, I would certainly
not infringe upon his judgement.
You are certainly entitled to your opinion.
You should continue to do what works for you.
Peace out.

I read your whole post and I still disagree the first time I read the WHOLE POST.

If you are watching what is in your partners area, what are you missing? What did you not "GET RIGHT" in your area? This is not being defensive, this is being concerned that in your NEED to "GET IT RIGHT" you are missing things that are in your area. You are correct, you need to get things right, but you sure do not need to be looking in your partner's area to "GET IT RIGHT." You need to get rules applications right. You need to make sure that you are doing what is fair or help your partner when they ask, but you do not need to be calling things that you are not in position or you did not see the entire play. And when you call things that are not in your area, chances are you did not see the entire play. Or at best you missed something that happen closer to you.

And if that is being defensive, then I guess I am defensive. But as I said, you take that philosophy where I live, I STILL say you will be watching more than you will be officiating. You must trust that your partner has the competence to do their job. If not, then you do not need to officiate with them, or they will not be there for long. But do not say that you can justify your attitude by saying you need to "GET IT RIGHT." Give your partners some credit, they were assigned the game just like you.

Peace.

[bossref]

Have a nice day!
I hope your partners keep you out of trouble.
PS This will be my last response on this subject.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally posted by bossref
Have a nice day!
I hope your partners keep you out of trouble.
PS This will be my last response on this subject.

Good-night,Barry.Btw,the name you picked-"bossref"-seems to fit your officiating philosophy very well.My last response,too.

[JRutledge]

Originally posted by bossref
Have a nice day!
I hope your partners keep you out of trouble.
PS This will be my last response on this subject.

Keep who out of trouble? I do not have that problem. Unlike yourself, I call what needs to be called and I pass on what does not need to be called. And if a partner is doing what you suggest, they will not be working with me. See, I have many games that I bring officials that are competent and do not need help. And if they feel the need to help me, I will not ask them back. It is that simple. See if you are not competent in your judgement, I will make sure that you will not be working with me. Just that simple.

Peace

PS: It may or it may not be my last post on the subject. See, this is just a discussion. You do not have to agree with me.

Peace again.

[crew]

rut,
seems pretty harsh to x any official you dont like. you do allow for mistakes right?

[JRutledge]

Originally posted by crew
rut,
seems pretty harsh to x any official you dont like. you do allow for mistakes right?

We are not talking about mistakes. We are talking about being unwilling to trust your fellow officials on the court. If an official cannot do that, they will not work with me. And I am sure I am not the only one that feels that way. I usually have the right to bring officials with me to certain games. I am not bring officials that cannot and will not trust their partners on the court. It is one thing to make a couple calls outside your area, but to do it on a regular basis is another.

[bossref]

This whole thing is getting so far off
the point! I don't believe that I inferred that
officials should "regularly" call in their partner's area.
I did mean to point out that officials are charged with calling fouls and violations as they occur. I did mean to point out that officials should have faith in their partner's judgement.I did mean to point out that players
and coaches expect the right call and don't care who has primary responsibility. I did mean to finally point out that
ON OCCASSION, should a partner get screened out (and a seasoned veteran can sense this quickly)or just "miss"
something IMPORTANT, his partner can "pick him up" by making the appropriate call (even a late whistle).
Some things HAVE TO BE CALLED! (You veterans know what I'm talking about.
BTW Most places I know about assign two referees. We don't have the luxury to hand pick our partners.
FYI I have been officiating basketball for 30 years.
I worked high school from 1973-79 in Boston and from 1990
until 1997 in San Diego. I officiated men and women JC
in the 80's and 90's in San Diego and was in 3 women's division 1 conferences through much of that time.
I currently own a business that assigns year round to over
35 facilities. It is entitled Best Of Sandiego Sports,
which is also known as BOSS. That is how the moniker bossref
came about (not as was recently hinted about some power
thing). My posts are to give opinions that might help referees that are still in learning mode. They were not intended to ruffle feathers of people who want to be closed minded and who want to engage in personal attacks.
Most of us are confident and very opinionated.
Those traits work well in our avocation/profession, but they are best tempered and used in a positive vein.
I hope to continue to visit this board while learning something from others and maybe even making some new friends. Carpe da Whistle and keep learning.
Barry Alman, BOSS Officials, San Diego, CA

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally posted by bossref
This whole thing is getting so far off
the point! I don't believe that I inferred that
officials should "regularly" call in their partner's area.
I did mean to point out that officials are charged with calling fouls and violations as they occur. I did mean to point out that officials should have faith in their partner's judgement.I did mean to point out that players
and coaches expect the right call and don't care who has primary responsibility. I did mean to finally point out that
ON OCCASSION, should a partner get screened out (and a seasoned veteran can sense this quickly)or just "miss"
something IMPORTANT, his partner can "pick him up" by making the appropriate call (even a late whistle).
Some things HAVE TO BE CALLED! (You veterans know what I'm talking about.
BTW Most places I know about assign two referees. We don't have the luxury to hand pick our partners.
FYI I have been officiating basketball for 30 years.
I worked high school from 1973-79 in Boston and from 1990
until 1997 in San Diego. I officiated men and women JC
in the 80's and 90's in San Diego and was in 3 women's division 1 conferences through much of that time.
I currently own a business that assigns year round to over
35 facilities. It is entitled Best Of Sandiego Sports,
which is also known as BOSS. That is how the moniker bossref
came about (not as was recently hinted about some power
thing). My posts are to give opinions that might help referees that are still in learning mode. They were not intended to ruffle feathers of people who want to be closed minded and who want to engage in personal attacks.
Most of us are confident and very opinionated.
Those traits work well in our avocation/profession, but they are best tempered and used in a positive vein.
I hope to continue to visit this board while learning something from others and maybe even making some new friends. Carpe da Whistle and keep learning.
Barry Alman, BOSS Officials, San Diego, CA

Barry,the above is a heckuva lot better explained than your original post.I got the impression from your original post that you were going to automatically call out of your area whenever you thought something was missed,not just on OCCASION.The above is logical!

[JRutledge]

Originally posted by bossref
This whole thing is getting so far off
the point! I don't believe that I inferred that
officials should "regularly" call in their partner's area.
I did mean to point out that officials are charged with calling fouls and violations as they occur. I did mean to point out that officials should have faith in their partner's judgement.I did mean to point out that players
and coaches expect the right call and don't care who has primary responsibility. I did mean to finally point out that
ON OCCASSION, should a partner get screened out (and a seasoned veteran can sense this quickly)or just "miss"
something IMPORTANT, his partner can "pick him up" by making the appropriate call (even a late whistle).
Some things HAVE TO BE CALLED! (You veterans know what I'm talking about.
BTW Most places I know about assign two referees. We don't have the luxury to hand pick our partners.
FYI I have been officiating basketball for 30 years.
I worked high school from 1973-79 in Boston and from 1990
until 1997 in San Diego. I officiated men and women JC
in the 80's and 90's in San Diego and was in 3 women's division 1 conferences through much of that time.
I currently own a business that assigns year round to over
35 facilities. It is entitled Best Of Sandiego Sports,
which is also known as BOSS. That is how the moniker bossref
came about (not as was recently hinted about some power
thing). My posts are to give opinions that might help referees that are still in learning mode. They were not intended to ruffle feathers of people who want to be closed minded and who want to engage in personal attacks.
Most of us are confident and very opinionated.
Those traits work well in our avocation/profession, but they are best tempered and used in a positive vein.
I hope to continue to visit this board while learning something from others and maybe even making some new friends. Carpe da Whistle and keep learning.
Barry Alman, BOSS Officials, San Diego, CA

I can only speak for myself, but I am sure Jurrasic Ref feels the same way. I only took issue with your comments. This is a little better explained sitituation. This time you explained it much clearer.

BTW, it is never personal, that is why we are here.

Peace