NCAA rules. Can anyone tell me definitively what NCAA rule applies to this scenerio? A1 has ball for the first of two. B1 violates. The lead official correctly signals the delayed infraction. A1 then calls timeout. When the ball is returned to A1 following the time out, does the delayed infraction still apply?

I can tell you that in NF play, the violation would still be penalized if the thrower missed the FT, after the time out. I believe that NCAA rules are the same.

What NFHS rule is that?

Any violation of 9-1 by the defense results in a replacement FT, if the attempt is not successful. A timeout by A does not change that.

I went into the Case Book, and found 9.1.4C, which documents this situation.

To answer the original question, my quick reading of the NCAA rulebook turns up nothing about this situation.

As another aside, in NFHS, why does team A get a new 10-second count if they are granted a timeout? Is it because it is "their" timeout perhaps?

five second throw-in
 

Mark,
You've seen teams call time out when they can't get the ball in, yo?
Same difference.
mick

Yes, I didn't look up the CB play but knew that it existed.

While there really isn't a separate NCAA casebook, I don't see any reason that the same principle wouldn't apply.

A timeout nevers excuses a violation. However, in the BC or throw-in situations, the violation has not yet occurred.

Thanks guys. It's just going to look really strange after the timeout when no one moves and we replace the first shot if it rims out. I guess good game management would be to make sure the coach B knows exactly how this one will go. I wonder if any coaches actually know this rule? Oops - dumb question. Most of them are too busy yelling "3 seconds"!

Well, if they knew the rules, they would know that the closed fist extended signaled that their team had committed a delayed violation.

Furthermore, if B1 violates and A calls timeout before the FT is shot, A1 still gets the original FT upon returning from the timeout AND, if missed, the replacement.

[Edited by Camron Rust on Nov 5th, 2001 at 03:43 PM]

We have been told by all of our conference commissioners to get the first violation. No doubles.

Actually there is one double violation...if B5 stpes in early and then A2 shoots an airball, we still have a double violation at the NCAA level...the only way around that one is to claim that B5 stepping in disconcerted the shooter, in which case we only go with the violation by B5 - but good luck selling that one to B's coach...all other violations in NCAA we penalize the first one only...

Right -- the NCAA change affects double LANE violations -- not (all) double FT violations.

So, if B1 and A1 are on the lane, then penalize the first.

If B1 is on the lane but A1 isn't (is a shooter or is behind the arc), then you can penalize both.

If neither B1 nor A1 is on the lane, then penalize both.

(THe above examples assume B violates first, obviously).

Again, I am guilty of not thinking of all the possible scenarios!!

double violations on free throws???
 

On free throws you said that there shouldn't be any double violations unless there is an airball on the attempt. What happins if the 1st violation is a delayed violation and the 2nd is an automatic violation.(NCAA rule)

[Edited by BOBBYMO on Nov 7th, 2001 at 10:37 AM]

Re: double violations on free throws???
 

Assuming those are both LANE violations, that's the point of the whole rule change -- penalize only the first violation.

BOBBYMO,

The only time that under the new NCAA rule this year that there will not be a double violation on the free throw is if the 2nd violation is by A TEAMMATE OF THE FREE-THROWER.

This may help clear it up in your mind. IF Team B violates first, then a teammate of the shooter, ignore the Team A violation. If Team A violates first, shut the play down immediately. If Team B violates, and then the SHOOTER violates, you will still have a double violation.

Reference 9-2.4 (page BR-106)

That's a good way to remember it, BIG!!!

The way it was discirbed at the Div. I meetings this year, is that you must grab the fist player to violate beow the free throw line, but the is and will be a double violation for anyone at the line or above it.

CASE PLAY : A4 is at the line shooting 1. B4 comes into the lane early, and before the ball hits the rim A3 comes in from the 3 point arch. This is a double violation, since A3 came in before the ball hit the rim. Go to the arrow.

Thanks guy's get the 1st and ignore the rest if they are both lane violations!!

[Edited by BOBBYMO on Nov 8th, 2001 at 10:28 AM]