Coach wants specific side on endline...
 

Official told me this happened to him the other day.

Coming out of a time-out, after a made basket by Team A...Coach B wants to know if it is alright to have the endline throw-in on the side (of the basket) closest to his bench. (He said he had already designed a play for that side.)

Questions:
Would you tell the Coach that you would stay in the same alignment that your crew was in on the made basket?

Would you tell the Coach that his player could simply run to that side if they needed to run a play designed for that side of the basket?

Would you tell the Coach, "no problem", and switch to the desired side that the coach requested? (Realizing that you have now created a switch in positions of the new L and new C.)

Would tell the Coach, "no problem", and switch to the desired side that the coach requested. (Partners coming from blocks or top of circle are not troubled.)

Sounds to me like if it is after a made basket, he has the whole end line to run. Put the ball in play where you had designated to your crew as the TO was called. If that is not the side he wants to run the play from, then his playeris free to move to that spot after you administer the ball. Don't let a coach tell you where to put the ball at any time. JMO.

Player can run the baseline. Doesn't matter where the "spot" is. However, the "spot" is not an option. There is only 1 place it can be for a spot throw-in: the closest point on the sideline or baseline to where the action that caused the deadball to occur. (Those are my words not the rules since I couldn't find my Official's Manual that discusses out of bounds locations.)

Unless, of course, the action happens in the paint. THen all bets are off. I, however, have never had a coach request a side. I have had them ask where the in-bounds would be, but never ask for a change of my call where it will be:eek:. How would you feel as the opposing coach if you heard THAT conversation? No way would I let a coach dictate anything like that to me.

Not a big deal. I'd go to the side he wanted.

Good points, except the ball was made dead by the basket. There is no location closest to the ball in this case. There is no 'spot' in this case. Move to the other side, wait for your partner(s) to adjust, remind the players he can run the line and put the ball in play.

Right. I just wasn't clear. Those are two separate situations. Brevity isn't always the best.

Unless of course the ball was already at someone's disposal when the TO request was made.

But, I've never had a coach request a certain spot to begin a non-designated spot throw-in so I've never had to think about it.

I would be interested to see if you can provide a rule for this (not saying you can't, just too lazy to look myself).

Anyway, consider yourself challenged :)

I have had an in-thrower, after a score, request a time out in a press situation, and then allowed the end-line throw-in when the teams returned.

That don't make no nevermind. Case book play 7.5.7SitC(d). They can still throw-in from anywhere along the endline after the TO.

You said the ball is always dead when these time-outs are requested. My point is that the ball is not always dead. Sometimes it is live because it is a the disposal of the throw-in team. So in those cases I start the thrower-in at the appropriate spot but remind him/her that they still have the privilege of running the base-line.

And as I stated previously, I've never had a coach ask me to start the throw-in from a specific spot, they always just want to confirm that their player can run the base-line.

Yeahbut what I'm saying is even in this case I will let him start at whatever side he wants. Why? Because the ball was not made dead at a spot, it was made dead at the endline. He's entitled to be anywhere on the endline - start, middle or finish of the throw-in.

If you have a rule to show I'm wrong I would be glad to see it.

So....what if the thrower is right in the middle of the paint when the TO is called. Would you still pick a side, or let the coach choose which side to start?

Or even worse, would you put the ball in play directly under the basket? :D

If the coach asked for a side I would fulfill the request. If no request is made I would look to see where my parter(s) gravitated to and adjust accordingly.

Well, maybe not the middle.:) Outside the FT lane extended maybe.

I didn't say you were wrong about putting the ball in where the coach requested, I said you were wrong for saying the ball is always dead. (I've been reading to many of Jurassic's posts :) )

Agree. Isn't that what Dan was arguing about too?

I get soooooo confused sometimes.:D

[QUOTE=BadNewsRef] I've never had a coach ask me to start the throw-in from a specific spot[/ QUOTE]

BNR...you keep saying that you have never had a coach ask you what we are discussing. In 18 years of officiating, either have I. But, what difference does that really make...it happened to an official, I was asked, and IMO...the sitch can be used as a learning tool.

We, as officials, should strive to be consistent with our calls (or non-calls)...as seen here, we have different ideas as to what we would do in this situation.

FWIW...I told the official that I would have no problem with putting the ball in play on either side of the basket...as long as our crew had not already "set up" for the throw-in. IOW...if I was ready to administer the TI, I would not "switch" to the other side at the coach's request.

I dunno.
Partners will generally adjust to administrating official after a time-out, I think.

I have a hard time with the whole fulfilling the coach's request thing. If a time out is called, I try to indicate to my partner(s), where the ball will be put in play right away. This isn't the reason I do it, but it sure works for this situation too. Since I've already indicated where the throw-in will be, there's no reason for the discussion.

But there's no rules basis for refusing the coach's request if he makes it early enough.

No, but the mechanic does require one specific place for a throw-in, as I stated before. So unless the ball was dead in the middle of the lane, there's no option as to where the throw-in will originate by rule.

Again, keeping in mind that on the OP, this was after a made basket and the team will have the entire baseline.

It takes....what....5 seconds for every official to switch? I just don't think that it's really a big deal myself. I am gonna allow the defense time to re-set too though. That's only fair.

What rule?:confused:

Please cite it.

I don't have my books with me at work. Ball must be inbounded, though, at the point closest to where the ball was located when it became dead. Correct? Or am I confused and this is just in the Official's Manual?

It's a made basket, so there is no place closest to where it became dead. It does not need to be inbounded from any spot, since the player can move to anywhere along that endline. I'm hard enough to deal with as an official, I'm not going to enforce things that aren't there.

I hear you JR...but, I just don't think this looks too "clean". Once we are ready to put the ball in play...I wouldn't really like the coach shouting over to me to "switch" sides, again JMO.

Yes, maybe it would take only "5 seconds"...but, it might be argued the switching action disrupts the "flow". Also, now that the coach sees his "power'...will he abuse it, in these situations? i.e. Tight game...he likes the way one official lets um' bang on the boards...so he has the crew position itself with that official as L. Probably way over a Coach's thought process :rolleyes: ...so I'll stick with the "clean" and "flow" argument. ;)

Snaqwells. I am aware of that.:rolleyes: I think we have too many thought strands going here. When I responded to the OP first, that was what I stated. Then the thread got off on the tangent of a spot throw-in. Now we all keep jumping back and forth between the two situations.

After a made basket, it won't matter where the spot is, since the player has the entire endline, and therefore the coach has no need to request a specific spot. The whole conversation is moot.

However, IF there is a spot, unless the ball became dead EXACTLY in the middle of the lane, the rules (or at the very least mechanics guidelines) require that there is only 1 spot the ball can be inbounded from.

Is that clearer?????

And rook, I agree. Additionally, as I said before, how will the OTHER coach feel if he sees you change floor position on request? IF I were a coach, I'd be pretty upset, thinking some gamersmanship was going on. He could argue, WAIT! I set up my defense thinking the ball was going to be on that side and you just changed it on request???????

A fine example of why the NCAA mechanic of allowing us to bounce the ball across the key to the inbounder is a GREAT mechanic!! Inbounder can go to the other side if he/she wants to and we don't have to switch or rotate or anything...yep, I like it.

Not for the men's side though. I don't really like it all that much.

Yeah, that extra 5-7 seconds to switch really slows down the game. :)

Why don't you like it?

I would like to see the men's side adopt this.

I didn't realize the men's side didn't do this...hmmm - they should. And it's not the time factor, it's the fact that I might have to jog an extra 40 feet or so to get into a different position when it's not necessary - just bounce it across and let me save my energy!! :D

1) It's just not that hard to switch. So it doesn't really save any significant time or effort. So I'd just as soon do it like every other throw-in.

2) Purely aesthetics, but I think it looks a little lazy. I realize that's a purely subjective thing. But it's just my preference.

On a designated spot throw-in, yes I would agree. But if the player is free to run the baseline why would I make my partners move?

...and the rest of my statement was "so I've never had to think about it." I in no way discounted the merits of this discussion. Please go back and read all the words in all of my posts.

So here is a question since Dan said after a time-out the coach can request to have the throw-in anywhere he wanted.

A1 retrieves ball after made basket, Team B is pressing, A1 runs to the table-side corner of the endline, realizes he can't get the ball inbounds and requests a TO. Before Team A huddles up Coach A tells you he wants to begin his throw-in at the opposite corner of the base-line.

Do you grant his request?

I do. <i></i>

Already answered. Case book play 7.5.7SitC(d) says that team A may take their throw-in after the TO from anywhere OOB along the endline. They can pick where they want to start, except in the lane of course.

Let's review: the throw-in is not at any spot, the player is entitled to be anywhere behind the endline from the start to the finish of the throw-in. Where the player is standing when he's granted a timeout does not change that fact.

So based on what rule, exactly, do you not grant his request?

Another question...
 

Not being argumentative, just trying learn.

B2 fouls A2 as such that Team A will again have a throw-in with privileges to run the baseline. Do we start the throw-in anywhere or do we start it at point nearest the foul?

Reason I have been debating this situation so much is that I always interpreted "from anywhere OOB along the endline" as meaning the team could run the baseline, I never interpreted it literally as that the team could also request to start the throw-in at any point along the baseline. And as I wrote earlier, I've never had the situation come up so I've never had to think about it before.

If the situation is as described in the OP, just put the ball in play on the side that the coach wants. There are SOOOOOO many other things in a game that are more important to worry about!!!! This isn't one of them....

BTW - anyone remember the UK vs Duke game (aka The Greatest College Game Ever)? Remember that Kentucky scored a basket w/ :02.1 left - Duke then takes a TO (no "spot" determined). Even though the crew wants C opposite the table for last second shot duties, where does Duke put it in? You guessed it, on the endline opposite the table. I'm betting that Duke asked for that side and the official (Tim Higgins) obliged them......take a look:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AY-iq58_oz4

Guys don't get into a power trip with the coaches on this; let 'em inbound where they want in this situation. What do you care where it gets put in?

The answer to your question is "anywhere" imo, News. There's nothing in the rules that I know of that says that they <b>can't</b> start the throw-in anywhere that they want along the endline, if it's an unrestricted throw-in.