Coach late in bringing team out for 2nd half
 

Had a couple of newer officials ask me how to handle this.

They had asked some other veteran officials in our association and had gotten different answers.

Situation:
Boys JV

Team A has delayed coming back on the court, from the locker room, to start the 2nd half.
Game management sent someone to the locker room to advise Coach A that he needs to get his team on the floor....still no team A.

Officials use the resumption of play procedure and put the ball on the floor...since the arrow was Team A's.
Violation...officials give ball to Team B for throw-in...Team B goes in for an uncontested lay-up.

Officials decide not to put ball on floor again and issue a T on Team A.
Coach is now coming back from locker room as Team B is shooting the 2 FT's for the T.
Coach A says nothing...and later says he is fine with the procedure used.

Did the officials use the correct procedure?
What would you have done if you were the R?

10-1-5a
10.1.9 COMMENT

Edited because of change-of-mind after reading case book play 10.1.9COMMENT.

Immediate technical foul as per rule cited above--10-1-5(a).

Yes...JR...that's what I told them...immediate T.

But, doesn't it seem the wording in 10.1.9COMMENT is kind of confusing?

Shouldn't this be a T one minute after the clock expired for half time?

I don't see the comment as confusing. It only says that you can use the RPP if both teams are on the court but one or both aren't breaking their huddle. If either team has not returned to the court yet, you give the T as proscribed in 10-1-5a.

If the team is on the floor, but not ready to play, use the RPP.

If the team is not on the floor, it's an immediate T if they're missing for a full minute.

Well stated.

?? In summary, Team A has not returned to the floor by the time the game is set to resume - result is a Technical on Team A. Two FTs and Team B gets the ball at the division line.

At what point do you let Team B inbound? Do you wait for Team A. And if Team A at the possesion arrow they keep it?

Yes. Yes.

We have a couple things wrong here. I agree that a technical foul was warranted in this case. However, this is an excellent opportunity to show your game management, preventative officiating skills.

#1.) It is the referee responsibility to notify the teams 3 minutes before the half is to begin. Did you do this? With this in mind, we can now throw out any technical fouls or the RPP and attempt to find out why the team is not there. Something major could have happened like a player getting sick and needing hospitalization. Here you are on the court giving a team a technical, dumb, imo.

#2.) You can not put the ball in play and one of the teams is not present. The rules do not allow you to do that. That was wrong, imo.

I would have found out where they where, went to their locker room and notified them myself. Then when I get back to the court, they need to be right behind me, if not, now we can start the technical foul procedures.

In the event, that someone from the table went to notify them. When the coach came out from the locker room, I would ask him if he was notified. If the team says no, I would do some quick investigating. Find out who the table person was, etc, etc. enforce from there. The reason I say this; I had a college game where the home team table personal did not notify the opposition that the halftime was about over, and it was a good little walk from the locker room to the floor. My guess is they did that to try and get the visiting team a technical. Rivalry schools....

Wow, you came up with the right answer after reading everyone else give the right answer. Not sure if I should call you "Johnny-come-lately" or "Blister" (shows up after the work is done). Frankly, I'm guessing "Congressman" might be correct, also.

That said, the OP stated that game management had already notified the coach. If we find out something major had happened; I'm going to retract the T and suspend the game.
Not just IYO, but according to the rule as well. I'll give you credit for getting it right; even though everyone else who's posted on this has already said this.

Gotta hear this. How would you enforce this if the table says they notified the coach and the coach says they didn't. Who are you going to believe, Johnny?
First you tell us that you won't use RPP because of the results of a 5th grade game, and now you want us to believe you officiate college basketball? If anyone here is buying this; they really ought to p!$$ in a cup and send it in for testing.

The T which is forbidden? :D

No, you can believe what you want to believe. I have no reason to lie or make up what I'm saying, and if I did, that would be quite an imagination. I'm merely sharing what I have experienced in hopes of just like most of you, I can help someone who is new, or even someone who is experienced do a better job.

A wise man once said, book knowledge is good but experience is the best teacher.

Or just read the manual first! ;)

Dangit! And now, due to your diligence, my error is there for all to see for posterity.

Where's that smell coming from? I think it's elderberries.

Quoteth Old School
Funny, that's what I thought you meant; and you're still wrong. If game management says they told the team and the coach disputes it; I'm going with game management. Aside from that, I don't recall a rule provision that relieves the team of responsibility for this at any point for any reason.

No, you are being anal trying to find a mistake as opposed to debating the topic. Remember, we are responsible to notify the teams 3 minutes before the half is schedule to start, not the home management. I gave you a clear example of where this could be an issue. Also, I don't think it's wise to give out technicals when you don't have definite knowledge. That's like pronouncing me guilty without a trial, remember, in America, you are incident until proven guilty. After a timeout and you give 1st horn notice, now you have definite knowledge. I keep telling you it's not about us, it's about the players and the game. Quite looking for trouble.

Merry Christmas!

If the clock runs out, I'm assuming game management did NOT notify the team and I'm sending an official to find the team. If they are not right behind the official, then we'll take care of bidness. But I'm trying to avoid that at most costs.

2-12-1
The timer shall:
. . . Note when each half is to start and shall notify the referee more than three minutes before this time so the referee may notify the teams, or cause them to be notified, at least three minutes before the half is to start.

Actually, home management notifying the team meets the requirement. The referee does NOT have to personally contact each team.

You beat me to it
 

I have never understood this to mean that I have to hunt down the team's respective lockerrooms and notify them myself. Reminding game management to be sure to do that fulfills my obligation of this duty.

Of course you don't have to go and notify the teams at 3 minutes.

It's not a good idea to listen to someone who doesn't own rule or case books, or the Maunual.

The point is, or at least my point is if you start throwing technicals based on your opinion that the home management did this, and the coach/team says they didn't. You might have open yourself up to some criticism, especially if the team loses by one. I think that's why the rule states it's the referee's responsibility. Be careful giving out T's in this situation.

If the team/s or not there ready to start the half, I'm with Rich, I'm sending someone there to get the team or I'm doing it myself. This is a rare situation where the teams are not out to start the half, but I have had it happen. I'll tell you what else to do. Freeze the clock at 1 minute or the 45 second mark, go get the team, when they enter the gym and start heading to their bench, start the one minute clock. Don't even let the one team out of there huddle to start the half without the other team being present. You also give the other team some time to get situated and get started. I learned a lot in that 5th grade girls game.

Game management my friend, goes a long way to having a successful game.

Back to another thread....I rarely start throwing T's around, particularly for something of this nature. But this bbs sometimes gets too hung up on the theoretical. Lets think about this scenario a little bit. First off, this rarely happens. But when a team is late coming out, what are we as officials doing? Are we standing on our blocks waiting? Are we conferring together? Are we talking about what bar we are going to after the game?

First thing I will do when I recognize this situation is happening is go to the table and ask if the offending team was notified at the 3:00 mark. (Because its usually the scoreboard operator that has this duty) If that person says, "Oh crap! I forgot!" I'll have him go and get the team right away and hold off with the heavyhandedness. (Virtually every time I've seen this situation happen, this was the reason).

However, if the team was definitely notified, then, and only then, will I enforce the letter of the law. If the home team failed to notify the visitors, and I whacked them for failure to come out timely, I'm pretty sure that a fairly unhappy coach would complain about me to the league office and I would be hearing from the commissioner.

:rolleyes:<i> </i>

Bingo, my point exactly! There are enough things that can happen that can get us in trouble, no need going out looking for it.

Okay, I understand the he said, she said thing, but if the management person tells me that he notified the team at the 3 minute mark, then I'm enforcing the rule. In short, I'm believing that person over the coach and if the team wants to protest to the state office that's fine. I'll let the administrators sort out who is telling the truth and who is lying.

You have absolutely no authority to do either one of those things. In fact, by doing the first one, you are setting aside a rule, namely 5-5-1. For the second item, the team certainly can be out on the court during halftime (2-7-4).

Making up your own rules and telling teams that they may not do something which the rules clearly say they can are very bad ideas. :(

And so does following the rules! :p