(H)air Controller.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by RookieDude

NFHS 3-5-3...... Changed the guidelines for headbands and sweatbands.

I was watching a H.S. football game last night. Some of the players had on "bands" above their elbows. The NFHS basketball rule regarding sweatbands says they must be worn BELOW the elbow.

In our state, we were instructed that sweatbands that were made for the purpose to be on the bicep can be worn above the elbow. The interpretation that we were given comes from someone that is on the NF Football committee. I do not know if this interpretation applies across the country, but this is what we were told.

Originally Posted by RookieDude

Question: Does anyone know of a "band" that could be legally worn above the elbow in basketball? I know we had some issues with this last year...some people say that these "bands" (that look an awful lot like a sweatband) are indeed supports for the upper arm.

From what I can tell the NF likes to take one rule in one sport and use it for other sports when something may translate. The NF apparently used the same logic and outlawed the use of "wristbands" above the elbow. If it is a bicep band, then those might be considered legal in our state. Understand that the language these illegal bands have to deal with the wrist, not other type of bands. So you might have to check with your local interpreter to clear this up. You know someone will find a way around this rule and I will be asking the same question of the people in my state. I will really want to know considering the ruling we were given in football this year.

Peace

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

The NF apparently used the same logic and outlawed the use of wristbands above the elbow. If it is a bicep band, then those might be considered legal in our state. Understand that the language these illegal bands have to deal with the wrist, not other type of bands. So you might have to check with your local interpreter to clear this up.

Nope, bicep bands are not legal for basketball unless they are compression sleeves.

From the 2006-07 POINTS OF EMPHASIS--2B COMPRESSION SLEEVES.
-"There has been an increase in players wearing sleeves for various reasons. Compression sleeves worn for medical reasons are legal. Decorative sleeves made of cotton or other non-supportive materials are prohibited".


From the COMMENTS ON THE 2006-07 RULES REVISIONS:
-"Headbands and wristbands must be unadorned (except for the permissible logo) and be the predominant color of the jersey or white. When wearing headbands and/or wristbands, all player must wear the same color and wear the items as intended. Only a single item may be worn on the head and/or on each wrist. Sweatbands must be worn below the elbow and be a maximum of four inches. A single headband, if worn, must be no wider than two inches".

Rule 3-5-3- defines "sweatbands"--"Items must be moisture-absorbing, non-abrasive and unadorned(except for the logo). Anybody wearing something that meets those criteria on their bicep is wearing it illegally.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Nope, bicep bands are not legal for basketball unless they are compression sleeves.

The point I am making is the same issue that made these things illegal in football (for the past couple years in my state) now has been clarified legal. The reason we were given is they are legal because they were made for that purpose. Now I agree that the NF Basketball Committee has explained it better. That does not mean there will not be a ruling that clarifies what is "decorative" means? I have no idea what the answer will be. There are bands made for the purposes to wear them above the elbow. I know this will be something I will ask the first rules meeting we have. A bicep band is not a sweatband. It is not uncommon for areas to decide how these things will be handled.

Peace

[Corndog89]

Not according to Merriam-Webster Online:

Main Entry: 1band
Pronunciation: 'band
Function: noun
Etymology: in senses 1 & 2, from Middle English band, bond something that constricts, from Old Norse band; akin to Old English bindan to bind; in other senses, from Middle English bande strip, from Middle French, from Vulgar Latin *binda, of Germanic origin; akin to Old High German binta fillet; akin to Old English bindan to bind, bend fetter -- more at BIND
1 : something that confines or constricts while allowing a degree of movement [this certainly defines what a hair band would do, but it doesn't say it has to be continuous]
2 : something that binds or restrains legally, morally, or spiritually
3 : a strip serving to join or hold things together: as a : BELT

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

So....are you saying that a string tied at the back is legal under NFHS rules?

I haven't received my new rules/case books yet so I can't comment on anything that may or may not be in there, but there's nothing I can find in either the '05-'06 rules or case books that disallows strings or ribbons to tie up hair.

In all seriousness, what am I missing?

And if the whole issue is tied up [no pun intended, but I like it anyway] in the definition of the word "band" then there is most certainly room for interpretation. An elastic piece of cloth can't be a string, i.e., "a strip serving to join or hold things together, as a belt"? The NFHS needs to be clearer and more specific if they mean a continuous piece of cloth or rubber.

JR or anyone...So again I ask, what am I missing? Where in the rules, case book, POI's, or elsewhere does it say that a string or ribbon can't be used to tie up hair? I don't pretend to be a rules expert and I'm not trying to be an a$$hole; this is a genuine question.

And again, "band" is the word the NFHS chooses to identify the type of (elastic) rubber or cloth used to control hair. They either need to be more precise as to what they mean (see M-W definition of "band" above) or tell us which dictionary they use as their standard so we can check their definitions. Hey, former President Clinton asked "What does 'is' mean?", so there is always room for interpretation if a communication (a rule in this case) isn't perfectly clear and precise.

This situation seems to fit Rainmaker's question from a few days ago...If the rules don't specifically prohibit something should the official on the floor rule on it, unless as under Rule 3-7 ('05-'06 Rules Book)? Unless a string or ribbon is identified as a safety issue, why should I play "fashion police" as someone else suggested earlier? I'm certainly not going to allow an unsafe situation...I had a mother very angry at me once because I wouldn't let her daughter play in a rec game with beads braided into her hair...but it has to be safety related.

Trying to be educated...Thanks.

[JRutledge]

Corn,

Unless the NF wants to clearly outlaw this, then all we are doing is speculating what should be done. Actually it would be up to the Referee on the game. I would not worry about a string in the hair or worry about liability based on this. I guess we all have things to worry about.

Peace

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Nope, bicep bands are not legal for basketball ....

They're not legal in football either. Some may call them bicep bands but they are still sweat bands and they are still illegal.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

They're not legal in football either. Some may call them bicep bands but they are still sweat bands and they are still illegal.

And they have no functional purpose other than decoration.

Headbands keep sweat out of the eyes.

Wristbands keep sweat off the hands so that can grip the ball.

Since a basketball is rarely tucked away between the upper arm, lower arm, and torso for a running play, a bicep band has no possible purpose aside from trying to look like someone on TV.

[Corndog89]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Corn,

Unless the NF wants to clearly outlaw this, then all we are doing is speculating what should be done. Actually it would be up to the Referee on the game. I would not worry about a string in the hair or worry about liability based on this. I guess we all have things to worry about.

Peace

Rut

Thanks for the response. This is exactly how I see it, but others seem to see it very differently...just trying to understand their logic. Thanks...

[zebraman]

Let's get the season started so we can have better threads. 68 posts about hair strings. Whooo boy.

[rainmaker]

Originally Posted by zebraman

Let's get the season started so we can have better threads. 68 posts about hair strings. Whooo boy.

I know! I've been gone all weekend and what do I find at the top of the list after four days?

Isn't there anyone doing fall ball?

Mick, haven't you had any interesting situations?

[Jimgolf]

Originally Posted by RookieDude

The NFHS basketball rule regarding sweatbands says they must be worn BELOW the elbow.

If your hands are over your head, is the bicep band above or below your elbow.

By the way, if you allow the bicep band and someone gets injured by it, apparently you are liable.

Negligence requires that you know (or should know) that a dangerous situation could occur.

Attire regulations have little to do with safety. A hairband that is tied in a bow is no more dangerous than one that is elastic, and a bicep band is no more dangerous than a wrist band. Just as a green hairband may be illegal, it is no more dangerous than a red hairband.

NFHS does not like individuality. If you have any doubt about an attire regulation, just think, "What would Big Brother do?"

No whole wheat allowed. Wonder Bread only.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Jimgolf

If your hands are over your head, is the bicep band above or below your elbow.

By the way, if you allow the bicep band and someone gets injured by it, apparently you are liable.

Negligence requires that you know (or should know) that a dangerous situation could occur.

Attire regulations have little to do with safety. A hairband that is tied in a bow is no more dangerous than one that is elastic, and a bicep band is no more dangerous than a wrist band. Just as a green hairband may be illegal, it is no more dangerous than a red hairband.

NFHS does not like individuality. If you have any doubt about an attire regulation, just think, "What would Big Brother do?"

No whole wheat allowed. Wonder Bread only.

Well, it's true that some of these rules are a pain in the azz. However, they are still rules.

I don't particularly like to tell players to pull their pants up and tuck their shirts in either, but I kinda do it faithfully anyway.

Lemme make a little suggestion for all of the people who don't like the rules as written(and personally, I ain't fond of some of them either). If you're being observed in the state playoffs at the end of the year, and you want to move deeper, it might be a good idea to make sure that illegal sweatbands, bicep bands, etc. aren't worn in that game. Of course, if you disagree, feel free to ignore that advice.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Well, it's true that some of these rules are a pain in the azz. However, they are still rules.

I don't particularly like to tell players to pull their pants up and tuck their shirts in either, but I kinda do it faithfully anyway.

Lemme make a little suggestion for all of the people who don't like the rules as written(and personally, I ain't fond of some of them either). If you're being observed in the state playoffs at the end of the year, and you want to move deeper, it might be a good idea to make sure that illegal sweatbands, bicep bands, etc. aren't worn in that game. Of course, if you disagree, feel free to ignore that advice.

How do you come to that conclusion? Not every state is going to give a damn about this rule the way you claim they will.

Peace