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Old Thu Feb 02, 2006, 10:04am
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Question

I refereed a jv girls game last night. I am a 2nd year official.

The crewchief for the game said I was getting beat on fastbreaks consistently.

I am always concerned about being "straight-lined" on these plays. Consequently, I slow down to get what I feel is a better angle.

Did I do something wrong???
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Old Thu Feb 02, 2006, 10:10am
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If you're "consistently" getting beat on fast breaks, then you're doing something wrong -- being too deep as T, not reading the play properly, ...

If it happens occasionally (once or twice a game), then you're probably okay.

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Old Thu Feb 02, 2006, 10:14am
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Quote:
Originally posted by suntzu45
The crewchief for the game said I was getting beat on fastbreaks consistently.

I am always concerned about being "straight-lined" on these plays. Consequently, I slow down to get what I feel is a better angle.
suntzu45,
Welcome to the forum.

Work on anticipating the play.
Concentrate on the direction of the teams.
Keep moving for better angles.
Never plant your feet on the court.
Stay off your heels.

mick


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Old Thu Feb 02, 2006, 10:14am
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Quote:
Originally posted by suntzu45
I refereed a jv girls game last night. I am a 2nd year official.

The crewchief for the game said I was getting beat on fastbreaks consistently.

I am always concerned about being "straight-lined" on these plays. Consequently, I slow down to get what I feel is a better angle.

Did I do something wrong???
Just curious are you in a 2 or 3 man crew?? Either way as the trail official you shouldnt get beat. You have to anticipate the change of possesion. Now, everyone is going to get beat on occasion, so dont think that getting beat once is awful or anything. As the trail, once possesion changes you are now the lead, you have to get to the baseline to be in proper position. Coaches get very upset when your not in position on that fast break and they feel that a foul was committed. Now that being said dont worry about coaches (like me) but do your best to anticipate the COP and bust it to your spot. Getting beat in a 2 man crew every once in a while is okay. In a 3 man it's almost unacceptable.
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Old Thu Feb 02, 2006, 10:14am
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If I'm getting beat on a fast break I usually try to keep moving but alter the direction to get an angle through the play. If that is not possible, I stop just long enough to see that play then continue down.

In my opinion, if you are getting beat continously you are either out of shape or you run in the same place for too long

There have been times (twice in boys games) where in the first quarter and a half I was getting beat consistently...both teams just had a lot of speed. I starting setting up deeper when at trail. If you do that, remember to take two quick steps toward the foul spot when you blow your whistle...that way when everyone locates the person in the funny looking shirt that just blew his whistle they see you in better position.

That's just what I do...but then I am not the one evaluating you or assigning you games. Did you ask him what you could do as an alternative?
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Old Thu Feb 02, 2006, 10:56am
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Getting beat from time to time is part of what we do. IMO, someone who NEVER gets beat is cheating the rebounding action from his trail position. There is even times when it's acceptable to get beat in 3-person but this should not be a consistant thing. I'm with your crewchief, you should not get beat more than once in a GJV game and maybe not even that much. Maybe get some faster shoes.
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Old Thu Feb 02, 2006, 10:58am
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If it is 2 person, it is far better to get beat occasionally than bailing on your partner too soon or working too high at trail that you miss plays or lose credibility because of the length of the call.

If you are getting beat in 3 person or on plays that are not changing possession even or behind you then you have a problem.

It could be fitness.

It could be the plow you are pulling.

Or it could be that you are routinely not doing what the name suggests, TRAILLING the play, or when you move you are not on the balls of your feet so you must re-set them to change direction.
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Old Thu Feb 02, 2006, 11:02am
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In 3 person camp, they emphasized the Trail going deeper...like to top of the key. And they were willing to trade off getting beat occasionally for better front court coverage. I think they were really trying to avoid calls in the paint being made by the Trail from the division line.
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Old Thu Feb 02, 2006, 11:10am
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Question

Quote:
Originally posted by FrankHtown
In 3 person camp, they emphasized the Trail going deeper...like to top of the key.
I encourage the 28' mark as the initial set-up for Trail.
Anyone else?
mick
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Old Thu Feb 02, 2006, 11:36am
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Quote:
Originally posted by blindzebra
If it is 2 person, it is far better to get beat occasionally than bailing on your partner too soon or working too high at trail that you miss plays or lose credibility because of the length of the call.

If you are getting beat in 3 person or on plays that are not changing possession even or behind you then you have a problem.

It could be fitness.

It could be the plow you are pulling.

Or it could be that you are routinely not doing what the name suggests, TRAILLING the play, or when you move you are not on the balls of your feet so you must re-set them to change direction.
An inexperienced official who can't anticipate the COP well can compensate by being able to run like a gazelle.

An experienced official can get a few extra steps by being aware of the change in possession or by anticipating the COP well. Once you've done this for a while, you can see an uncontested clean rebound before the ball's in the rebounder's hands.

I get beat once a half or so in varsity games. I'm not a fast person. I'll get an angle from behind. Doesn't bother me a bit.
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Old Thu Feb 02, 2006, 11:41am
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I think you will get beat more than a few times under the right circumstances in games. Many of these kids are pretty good athletes and if we all think we are not going to get beat we are not being honest with ourselves.

Mick, the 28' mark is usually a good start. On a shot I will go as low as the top of the 3 point line. If the Trail has to call a foul in the lane on a rebound he/she should not be much higher than the 3 point line in my opinion. Most of the players are going to go inside the 3 point line on most rebounds and you will get beat if the ball comes off the rim hard and a team starts throwing the ball up court. I know when I work games I might get beat 4 or 5 times if the right kind of style is played.

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Old Thu Feb 02, 2006, 12:53pm
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Jeff this wasn't boys varsity, it was girls jv.

sun -- I've always struggled with getting beat, and here are some ways I'm starting (just this season) to deal with it better.

Evaluators in my neck of the woods are pretty harsh on trail being too far back during half-court play, and especially if we take a step back during the shot and rebounding action. I try to step down one good stretch when the shot goes up, and then as soon as it touches the rim, I'll rotate myself to be prepared to beat the fast break. If the ball bounces out to the top of the key, or if a player starts back, even without the ball, I"ll start a sprint, even if it means coming right back again. If the ball rebounds way out, and I start to go, and then it goes back in for another shot, I just step back down again. This has helped a lot.

Also, if there is a fast break with the opponents side-by-side, one or two quick, long steps early on should put you in a good position out front. Stay wide enough that you can get a good angle between the players. If you see that you're not going to make it, drop back, and step toward the center, so that you can see between.

Around here the unwritten rule is that you shouldn't get beaten more than once or twice a game, except with a couple of specific teams that really make a religion of the fast-break plays.

If you work on it at the jv girls level, concentrating on the timing and rhythm of stepping down and cheating back at the right moments, you'll be able to move it up to varsity pretty easily.
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Old Thu Feb 02, 2006, 12:58pm
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Thank-you everone

Thank-you Rainmaker

It's my second-year with so much too learn. I've got plenty of hustle and heart and will work on this.
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Old Thu Feb 02, 2006, 01:15pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by rainmaker
Jeff this wasn't boys varsity, it was girls jv.
I understand that. The question was not just about JV girlÂ’s basketball and how not to get beat. I just did not want anyone to walk away from this post thinking they are not going to get beat. They could work College Women's basketball and you will get beat from time to time.

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Old Thu Feb 02, 2006, 01:17pm
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Re: Thank-you everone

Quote:
Originally posted by suntzu45
Thank-you Rainmaker

It's my second-year with so much too learn. I've got plenty of hustle and heart and will work on this.
Sun...where do you officiate?? Are there any good veteran officials in your area to work with?? Maybe just go to a varsity game and watch the officials. It is very hard to go to a game and not watch the game. But try to watch as little of the game as possible. Pay attention to the positioning and footwork of each official. Hopefully you will be able to pick up some things that will help.
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