Elbows swinging

[dknick78]

During a sub-varsity game last night. We had a swinging elbow after a defensive rebound. Nothing that connected. I didn't call anything and I warned the kid during the next dead ball.

Correct?

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally posted by dknick78
During a sub-varsity game last night. We had a swinging elbow after a defensive rebound. Nothing that connected. I didn't call anything and I warned the kid during the next dead ball.

Correct?

By rule, no.

For that level of play, maybe.

[rainmaker]

Originally posted by dknick78
During a sub-varsity game last night. We had a swinging elbow after a defensive rebound. Nothing that connected. I didn't call anything and I warned the kid during the next dead ball.

Correct?

Nope. If it's swinging enough that you think it needs a warning, it should probably have been a violation. If it connected it would be a PC foul, if not an intentional foul.

[tjones1]

Probably, if it was excessive swinging with no contact it would be a violation. However if he just did it once (not excessive), I probably would have told him to be careful, as you did.

[refnrev]

Was it part of the natural body movement after the rebound or was it excessive?

[Ref Daddy]

I watch for HIGH flying elbows to make the judgement. If it would have connected in someones face or head - gotta deal with it. Time to be talking to the table.

A sloppy clear-out .... maybe just a warning.

[ditttoo]

Would your "call" have made the game better? Doesn't sound like it - sounds like you handled it appropriately.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally posted by ditttoo
Would your "call" have made the game better? Doesn't sound like it - sounds like you handled it appropriately.

I'm confused. What does ignoring a violation have to do with making the game better?

Do you really apply that criteria to all violations- traveling, out-of-bounds, palming, 10 seconds, over and back, kicked ball, etc.?

[johnny1784]

Originally posted by Jurassic Referee

I'm confused. What does ignoring a violation have to do with making the game better?

Do you really apply that criteria to all violations- traveling, out-of-bounds, palming, 10 seconds, over and back, kicked ball, etc.?

I do understand why an official can not make the right call.

Did the player swing their elbows excessively? If so, call the violation immediately but if the player makes contact with an opponent then call the technical.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally posted by johnny1784

I do understand why an official can not make the right call.

Did the player swing their elbows excessively? If so, call the violation immediately but if the player makes contact with an opponent then call the technical.

If a player makes contact with an elbow to an opponent during a live ball, the choice of calls that you have are:
1) player control foul
2) intentional personal foul
3) flagrant personal foul

What you can't call is a technical foul of any kind. Technical fouls are non-contact fouls during a live ball or contact fouls during a dead ball, as per rule 4-19-5.

[Nevadaref]

Originally posted by Jurassic Referee

If a player makes contact with an elbow to an opponent during a live ball, the choice of calls that you have are:
1) player control foul
2) intentional personal foul
3) flagrant personal foul

What you can't call is a technical foul of any kind. Technical fouls are non-contact fouls during a live ball or contact fouls during a dead ball, as per rule 4-19-5.

Also if that player DOESN'T have the ball you could call
4) a common foul

What JR is telling you is straight from pages 68-69 of the 2002-03 Rules Book.

Just remember that if contact is made and the ball is live, you CANNOT CALL A TECHNICAL FOUL.

[johnny1784]

Originally posted by Jurassic Referee

If a player makes contact with an elbow to an opponent during a live ball, the choice of calls that you have are:
1) player control foul
2) intentional personal foul
3) flagrant personal foul

What you can't call is a technical foul of any kind. Technical fouls are non-contact fouls during a live ball or contact fouls during a dead ball, as per rule 4-19-5.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, you're right.

Are you ever wrong with your answers?

Do you ever debate on other sporting rules?

Where are you located, Alaska?

Always a thank you for your replies and postings.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally posted by johnny1784
[/B]

1) Are you ever wrong with your answers?

2) Do you ever debate on other sporting rules?

3) Where are you located, Alaska?

[/B][/QUOTE]1) Sometimes

2) Yes

3) No

[ditttoo]

Ignore violations? I would suggest it happens all the time...advantage v disadvantage. It is even mentioned in the "book" that not every individual violation/foul must or should be called.

We all make calls "in the context of the game"; nothing new here. Even little dibblers get by with an occasional travel or two.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally posted by ditttoo
Ignore violations? I would suggest it happens all the time...advantage v disadvantage. It is even mentioned in the "book" that not every individual violation/foul must or should be called.

Interesting. Where may I find that language in the "book"? I knew that you could apply advantage/disadvantage to physical contact, but I was never aware that it was written in the "book" that you could also apply it to actual violations and fouls.